ENZYMES

beautifulsoul

Super Moderator
I was wondering what type (brand name) of enzymes you take and how many per meal/snack? I know some of it depends on weight and such but I'm just curious. I've switched enzymes at least 3 or 4 times since the FDA isn't approving them. I've been taking Creon 12,000 for at least a year and half or maybe two years now. They aren't working as well for me.... Maybe it's me but it seems like I've read about the Creons not working for a lot of people. I saw my dietician last week & she mentioned that the FDA actually approved the enzymes I was taking before Creon which was ULTRASE. She said they should be back on the market soon. In the mean time my doctor raised my enzyme dose to see if that helps any. I guess I'm confused as to why some enzymes work well and other don't? What works for you?
Thanks for any input.
 
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kross10911

Guest
I currently take Zenpep. I had been taking Ultrase mt 18 before. Good to know they are being approved. But im not sure I will switch back..

After Ultrase was taken off the market I tried Creon and HATED them. Couldnt stand the taste, smell and how they worked for me. I had more gas with them for sure.

One thing ive noticed with the Zenpep is that I dont have the smelly gas or the amount of gas I used to have when taking Ultrase or Creon. I do experience constipation more often now ( even worse at the moment because of me being pregnant). Im assuming I was getting the constipation issues with Zenpep due to them working better. I currently take 3,4, or 5 of them depending on the amount of food and what I eat. But usually 4 is the magic number for me. they are the 20,000.
 

lilmac7

New member
I take nutrizym10 (UK brand), the 10 means they are 10,000. I take 6-8 with meals depending what I eat and how much. Snacks obviously adjusted down. They seem to work fine for me. I've tried the creon 24s I believe and they worked fine for the time I took them dosage was basically cut in half compared to the Nutrizym10 cause they're double the strength basically. I did notice how the Creons smell really strong though, I popped that bottle open and my breath was taken away lol
 

lilmac7

New member
Can't say I tasted anything with Creeon either but there is definitely a chemical stifling smell when the bottle was opened.
 

randomgirl

New member
I'm taking Creon 12,000 also. If I eat a whole meal then I take 5 pills. I used to take 3, then 4, but now 5 pills. I've been taking Creon for yeaaars and it seems to work pretty well.
 

Ratatosk

Administrator
Staff member
DS takes Creon 12,000 as well. Takes 7-8 with meals and 4-5 with snacks. He was on Pancrease MT 10?s and when they reformulated them to Pancreaze, our insurance refused to add them to their list of approved meds and we'd have to pay for it 100%. They still haven't after two years. Fortunately they work for him. Our other option would've been zenpep.

It's my understanding that FDA approval was just obtained for a reformulation of Pancreacarb. Some people have had good results taking a bicorbonate capsule/tablet with their creon and/or zenpep to make is similar to the pancreacarb formula.
 

ecsnut

New member
Hi there..yes....Pancrecarb will be back on the market as Pertzye and I heard they will be available next week. They are the only enzyme with bicarbonate which helps the enzymes to work better by raisng the ph. We have used it with Creon beofre it went off the market and are so glad they are coming back. It will make a big difference to people who are not doing well on the enzyme they are using.
 

kosdancer

Member
Your problem may be your dosing. I'm actually really surprised that nobody counts fat like I do; my gastroenterologist told my parents when I was born that they would have to count fat and dose enzymes accordingly. If you think about it in terms of how diabetics handle insulin - they adjust their dose according to the carbs they eat - it makes sense. I am on Zenpep, I was on ultrase for 16 years. I use the 20s and 10s; a 20 covers 8g of fat and a 10 covers 4g of fat (for if I am eating a number not divisible by 8.) I add more on certain foods like pork, and take high protein foods into account as well. I can have 3-4g of fat on my own. Each person will have different needs of course, but this has worked very well for me. I've never had problems gaining weight or maintaining it. It's not a perfect method, as of course you can't always know how much fat you are consuming but it definitely works...just something to consider!
 

clarereal

New member
<strong>My son is 28 and was on Ultrase mt 20 until they pulled them off the market. He takes Zen Pep now and they aren't as effective as the former....Different brands have different combinations of ingredients....Don't know why different ones work differently for people.....Does anyone else? ck</strong>
 

beautifulsoul

Super Moderator
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote><i>Originally posted by: <b>Ratatosk</b></i> DS takes Creon 12,000 as well. Takes 7-8 with meals and 4-5 with snacks. He was on Pancrease MT 10?s and when they reformulated them to Pancreaze.</end quote>
I was on those too. (Pancrease MT 10's) For a LONNGG time! Then I had to switch to Ultrase. It seems like people who have been on the same enyzme for a long period of time have trouble tolerating a different brand maybe?
 

LittleLab4CF

Super Moderator
I had been on Pancrease, and though I had to donate my right ear, I and our attorney along with some tap dancing by my CF specialist finally got insurance to go with scripts for two different strengths. My wife is big on keeping a log of my meds, meals and liquids and bowel habits. I do this reluctantly mainly because it is just an unpleasant feeling seeing my CF reduced to a spreadsheet.

The data I have accumulated has been massaged, allowing me to dial in better digestion. I caught wind Pancrease was going away and horded two years supply. Creon's smaller capsules are the tell. Sodium bicarbonate acts as a buffer, potentiating the gastric acids in the stomach and duodenum. Too much enzymes contribute to constipation, according to my CF doctor and my log.

Although my 2001 pancreatic function test was so bad, my doctor answered my pin down questions of of how long I probably will live and the likely causes that will be my end game. My PF test was a North American record for bad by a considerable amount. I am pleased to note I have exceeded the most optimistic limit by five years and now 62, 72 is likely. My PI wasn't from a failure of pancreatic function, the thick as honey digestive goo was to viscous to drain into the duodenum. A portion of my daily protein comes from autodigestion of the pancreas. This of course is shared by many CFers. Recent patients of his are repeating new advice to amp up hydration emphasizing adequate electrolyte ingestion. This has helped considerably with my tendency toward constipation in the short three weeks I have increased my hydration/electrolytes.

I appreciate all the informative posts. Especially the times that old friends are coming back like Pancrease. For the record, we had no option in retaining and using a lawyer to bite on the faces of insurance adversaries.
 

Twistofchaos

New member
These enzymes are not just for fat though, but also to hopefully get more out of your proteïnes and even carbs which can make a significant portion of some types of foods. So personally I don't count fat but estimate calories and dose on that (proteïne and fat also result in calories) but indeed make the exception for really fatty food just in case..<img title="Surprised" src="include/wysiwyg/tinymce/jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/img/smiley-surprised.gif" alt="Surprised" border="0" /> To stop Montezuma taking revenge. I've been using Creon 10.000 for over 20 years I guess, and take about one capsule per 200KCal. Tried Panzytrat 25.000 for a little while once, seemed to work the same but I couldn't really dose that for small meals so..back to Creon.
 
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katethekid

Guest
I take Creon 24,000 4-5 with meals and 2-3 with snacks <img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif" border="0">
 

erock77

Member
I've switched a few times b/c docs were concerned with how many enzymes I was taking. Did Creon for a Long time, switched last year or so to Zenpep 20. ~12 per meal. I was taking 14-16 creon 20's.
 

Printer

Active member
As you get older, more pancreatitic ducts become blocked. As a result you will eventually have to increase your enzyme intake in order to get the same result.
 

lilmac7

New member
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote><em>Originally posted by: <strong>erock77</strong></em> I've switched a few times b/c docs were concerned with how many enzymes I was taking. Did Creon for a Long time, switched last year or so to Zenpep 20. ~12 per meal. I was taking 14-16 creon 20's.</end quote>
Holy shizballs!!! <img title="Surprised" src="include/wysiwyg/tinymce/jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/img/smiley-surprised.gif" alt="Surprised" border="0" /> And I thought I took plenty with 6-8 10,000s, DANG! Guess I gotta give thanks and it could always be worse! IfI took that many I'd surelybe clogged to the gills and shoot out like a cannon ball if I was even able to pass gas with that blockage! LOL yeah I know sorry TMI...
 

beautifulsoul

Super Moderator
<img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif" border="0"> Mark... <img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif" border="0">
 

lilmac7

New member
Sorry, my mind couldn't help but think the agony I'd be in if I took that many as I am now. As it is now at times ifI judge wrong for the amount and type of meals I eat a few times in a row I'm either like a pipe that's been turned on or so bound up I wish I could just black out and wake back up when it's done and over with. For the most part those scenarios don't happen too often tho thank God and when it does it's usually just slackness on my part so I'm the one to blame for my troubles.
 

beautifulsoul

Super Moderator
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote><i>Originally posted by: <b>lilmac7</b></i> it's usually just slackness on my part so I'm the one to blame for my troubles.</end quote>
True. Happens to me sometimes too
But, I agree...That's A LOT of enzymes!
 
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