Lots of Nebulizers – Need Advice on Keeping them Clean

Gammaw

Super Moderator
What creativity Ratatosk. A great idea to color code the syringes so you can make them up ahead of time. I use a Sharpie to mark the nebulizer cups for TOBI. I was told we needed to make sure to keep them separate from the nebulizers for Xopenex. But I never thought about how I could keep the syringes straight if I made them up ahead of time, like I need to do for traveling. All our meds are off white! Makes it difficult. Color coded syringes would be great.

Aboveallislove - great link. I never even thought about buying in bulk. It will cost us about $25 to $30 a month for disposables. That's a great idea, again for traveling too. It's always been difficult to clean them in hotel rooms and airports. You guys are great. You've solved problems for me today and this wasn't even my thread!

As for the initial problem - sterilizing nebulizer cups - that is a great link and gives me pause. It's recent too and was the subject of one of the posts I referred to about baby bottle sterilizers. But still there were RTs that said no, you don't know what temperature they get to and how long it's maintained. For those who don't know me, I am a very cautious and suspicious parent! We're headed to our Clinic this week. I'm going to pull this stuff and ask them where it all stands! I know how hard it is at midnight after all treatments are done, lunches are packed and laundry is in, to stand there and sterilize another 8 nebbie cups for the morning. As easy as it can, sometimes I'm just too dang tired!
 

Ratatosk

Administrator
Staff member
Part of the issue with the sterilizer stems from whether they meet the optimum temps. One product in particular was the Germ Guardian, which was quite popular; however, someone on this site checked the temp during "sterilization" and found it didn't reach a high enough temp for a long enough period of time. Similar issues were brought up with using a dishwasher -- one person used a smaller, countertop dishwasher to run her nebs through. Supposedly the temp was high enough for sterilization purposes.

If there's an easier, safe way to do it, I'm all for it. Boiling a pot of neb cups over my lunch hour works best for me. I'm home by myself, so I can straighten up the kitchen, boil nebs, organize meds...
 

Aboveallislove

Super Moderator
Yeah, I hate doing nebs and use it for teaching experience for ds saying how I hate it but in life sometimes we have to do what we hate...hoping that helps later when he hates doing treatments. We've got it down to a sconce with me running dishwasher with them since I'm always home and dh boiling in morning why he wakes up and eats breakfast...I don't trust dishwasher but prefer that to hand washing before boiling....
 
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Dhobs

Guest
This has been a very informative thread!

It's interesting how varied the opinions of RTs can be. My daughter is currently on day eleven in the hospital (exacerbation/pneumonia/aspergillus colonization) and some RTs were surprised that the vinegar and water method is no longer recognized as effective for sterilization.
 

Gammaw

Super Moderator
Dhobs, your RTs are making me nervous!!! LOL!!!! Really, can't the CFF send something out!? The video and study erock referenced are as close as they seem to get right now. And the Pari instruction booklet has some detail in it. But I would think they could disseminate more thoroughly and more consistently than that.
 

politicaljules

New member
Boil gives me peace of mind

I've had two different baby bottle sterilizers. I tried to make them work, but they never were consistently hot enough and the time varied wildly. And a table spoon of water that produced maybe 2 minutes of steam is not enough to kill things like pseudomonas.

I am probably more technical than most because my background of being a nurse in the OR, and I find the CFF severely lacking on this issue. I mean they can come down hard on people not socializing together, but when it comes to sterilizing the medical device that delivers life saving meds into your lungs, they are wishy washy!! Makes no sense.

I do not trust baby bottle sterilizers when it comes to your lungs. Baby bottles are only highly disinfected because your GI tract is not necessarily sterile. Your respiratory tract should be much more sterile than your GI tract. Especially if you have cystic fibrosis.

On a baby bottle sterilizer, there is no temp gage and the steam does not penetrate the internal components of the cups where bacteria can hide, and just because it steams for two minutes does not mean it has done the job. Steam is a fickle thing, and unless you have a vacuumed sealed environment that penetrates all the surfaces of the cups to be sterilized, you have no way of ensuring sterility.

The medical standard of time for sterilizing with steam is 5-10 minutes, but that is in a vacuum controlled environment with high-pressured steam from internal boilers. There is not a bottle sterilizer out there with that kind of power.

There is no question what the temp is of boiling water. You know it is hot enough, well... because it is boiling. Mine get 10 minutes on top of the stove, and we add vinegar as well for hard water.

I have a large and a medium stock pot and enough neb-cups to last a week. When the weekend comes, I wash and sterilize them all. Sure it is a little more work, but you know what is even more work and more tiring?

Being in the hospital or on home IV meds from repeated infections because I did not sterilize my neb cups properly.
 
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Dhobs

Guest
Yeah, Gammaw, that alarmed me too! We've had a new RT almost every day and night and only two were unaware.

I just realized how many RTs that is - wow!
 
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Dhobs

Guest
When you boil your nebs, how do you sterilize the hard plastic pieces that melt in boiling water? I've melted so many things that I thought the bottle sterilizer was just fantastic.
 

mom24dodd

New member
I am a mom - and I totally hate the whole sterilization process - but it is for my son's health - so I never think I do not have time -this is something I make time for and stay up late if I have to. We use 6-8 per day - one clean new sterilized one for each use/med - and just rinse them after use - throw the used ones in a bucket - and sterilize all at once at the end of the night in a pot of boiling water on the stove. We set the water boiling just as my son begins his last treatment of the night - and by the time he is done - all we do is throw all the day's nebs in the boiling pot. He uses masks so we just wash those in anti bacterial dishwashing soap (they would melt if sterilized in boiling water). I have never melted any of the hard plastic neb parts - we use Pari LC Plus.
 

Ratatosk

Administrator
Staff member
I use reusable pari or side stream neb cups and have never had them melt. They WILL if you forget them on the stove and the pan runs dry. :) I wash nebs in warm soapy water, then boil for 10 minutes.
 

Gammaw

Super Moderator
Dhobs, I can only tell you my experience, but it would help to know what kind of nebs you have. When we first began nebbing in our house, (the first med was TOBI), the medical supply company gave us a Nebulizer compressor and a couple of Nebulizer cups. I was completely ignorant of the type of equipment we needed. I understood that I was supposed to boil the cups to clean and sterilize them in between treatments but I was repeatedly frustrated with the way they often melted! I struggled and struggled and finally a light went off and I started asking questions and researching out of my frustration. To make a much longer story short - my difficulties probably spanned a year - I discovered that Apria Healthcare, our provider, was giving us disposable nebbie cups, rather than PariLCPlus which are of course reusable, and despite the clear designation on the medical equipment prescription given to them by our CF Center. Even after my realization, I had to fight and fight with Apria because they kept insisting on disposables. I finally brought a batch down to them, dumped them on their desk and explained to them how they could be sued for negligence and malpractice giving a CF child or adult life threatening bacteria because they didn't follow prescriptions and the new parent of a or even an adult who didn't know what they needed wouldnt realize what the equipment provider had done by sustituting disposables to save a few bucks. I wanted them to at last thoroughly understand that as a CF parent new to nebbing, I had relied on their expertise to provide what i needed. And they were failing my son miserably.They quit doing it but I also quit using them.

So you understand now why my first question to you is, are you using disposables? Disposables are meant for people who are not immunocompromised in the way CFers are. My mother in law uses nebs for Albuterol treatments but she can use about anything and although she certainly cleans them, she also reuses for several treatments in a day and is not as stringent in her cleaning. And that's ok for the average person. But not for a CFer. Disposables will absolutely melt all over the place when boiled. They will tolerate it a couple of times, sometimes, but eventually disintegrate and warp. A PariLC Plus cup will NOT melt when boiled. I boil mine every day for 6 months with no problem. Then they need to be replaced.

I also discovered that the Nebulizer I was using was NOT the the best for TOBI. It took a lot to get a Pari Vios approved despite the Clinics recommendations and prescriptions thanks to oversight by the insurance company, but we eventually got it done. They drive me a little crazy too, but when they are working right, nebbing TOBI should only take about 15 minutes, not 30 or 45!

I would suggest if anyone is having any difficulty, put all your equipment in a bag and bring it to your next Clinic appointment. Let them look it over and make sure you have what you need and know how it should perform!
 
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