medic alert

2roses

New member
Jonathan,
Would it be beneficial to you as a medic to have the ID alert bracelet point to a meds list/card, as was suggested above? I've been thinking about getting IDs for my daughters in case they are in a car accident, etc., and are incapacitated. I thought listing cystic fibrosis, med allergies, and then the meds list card would be the minimum needed for them to be treated with their CF in mind. I like the idea of a USB drive w/this info, but I see your point that med personnel will probably not look for that if it's not part of protocol.
 

2roses

New member
Jonathan,
Would it be beneficial to you as a medic to have the ID alert bracelet point to a meds list/card, as was suggested above? I've been thinking about getting IDs for my daughters in case they are in a car accident, etc., and are incapacitated. I thought listing cystic fibrosis, med allergies, and then the meds list card would be the minimum needed for them to be treated with their CF in mind. I like the idea of a USB drive w/this info, but I see your point that med personnel will probably not look for that if it's not part of protocol.
 

Havoc

New member
It is nice to have, but usually on the back end of a call. Meaning, I can photocopy your list rather than ask you all that information, or I'll have it for my report if you are unresponsive. Many people, especially the elderly, have print outs of their history, meds and allergies that their kids made them, again it's nice in that it's a matter of convenience for us and the hospital. I can look at most people's shopping bag of meds (also very common) and put together a fairly complete medical history based on what meds you take (if I have access to them). As an aside, I never recommend taking medications with you to the hospital. Many times I'm handed aforementioned shopping bag full of medications and they get taken to the hospital and sometimes lost, or in the case of narcotics, stolen. Pancreatic enzymes would be an exception, as they are often difficult to get from pharmacy (and even then the dose is sometimes screwed up). In the case of traumatic injury, if you are hurt seriously enough to be unresponsive, there's a lot of priorities above your medical history and medications for me as a medic. It would be more useful for the emergency department, but after you are stabilized. I can say that in certain cases (especially if a minor is involved) having an "ICE" (In Case of Emergency), "parents," or "home" contact in your kids' phone is handy. Several times I have had kids in accidents and I always try to alert the parents if I have the time. If their condition is not terribly serious, I will also let the parent talk to the child. It can also be useful if your child is out with friends and has a minor injury. For example, your child is out with friends and takes a tumble off a bicycle or something. Someone sees and calls 911. You child might not be injured, or may have a minor sprain or something. Legally, I have to transport him or her to a hospital if no adult is willing to take responsibility and sign a refusal of medical care form. In that case, it's nice to be able to contact a parent to come to scene and let them make the decision (rather than get an $800 bill for a needless ambulance trip). Regarding allergies to medications. First it's important to define "allergy." Many times I'll ask a patient what they are allergic to and they say I'm allergic to medication X. I ask what happens when they take medication X and they will say "it makes me nauseated." That's not an allergy, it's an adverse reaction. An allergic reaction means hives, hypotension and possible airway complications. With that out of the way, let me list many of the medications we carry on an ambulance. That might help some people decide if having their medication allergies listed is warranted. I'll try to list them by category. Respiratory: Albuterol Hydrocortisone sodium succinate Solu-medrol (methylprednisolone) Ipratropium Bromide Magnesium Sulfate (Can be used for bronchospasm. Most of us don't like to use it as it causes a heat rush that often makes patients feel worse) Terbutaline Benzocaine spray (used sometimes for conscious or sedated intubation) Metaproterenol (alupent) (rarely carried anymore, at least here) Cardiac: Nitroglycerine Aspirin Atropine Bretylium Diltiazem (cardizem) Lidocaine Amiodarone Procainamide Verapamil Sodium Bicarbonate Dobutamine Dopamine Calcium Chloride 1:10,000 Epinephrine Furosemide Allergic reactions: Diphenhydramine (benadryl) 1:1000 Epinephrine Solu-medrol Pain: Nitrous Oxide Toradol Fentanyl Morphine Benzocaine tetracaine Nausea: Promethazine (phenergan) Ondansetron (Zofran) Anxiolytics: Midazolam (Versed) Lorazepam (Ativan) Diazepam (Valium) Diabetic: Glucagon D50 (50% dextrose solution) Oral glucose This isn't a complete list, we carry around 60 medications these days. These medications will also vary from state-to-state and region-to-region sometimes, but most of these are very commonly used in most areas. Some also fit into more than one category, but I didn't list them twice.

ETA: Having your kids wear medic alert bracelets might cause them some embarassment (just something to consider).
 

Havoc

New member
It is nice to have, but usually on the back end of a call. Meaning, I can photocopy your list rather than ask you all that information, or I'll have it for my report if you are unresponsive. Many people, especially the elderly, have print outs of their history, meds and allergies that their kids made them, again it's nice in that it's a matter of convenience for us and the hospital. I can look at most people's shopping bag of meds (also very common) and put together a fairly complete medical history based on what meds you take (if I have access to them). As an aside, I never recommend taking medications with you to the hospital. Many times I'm handed aforementioned shopping bag full of medications and they get taken to the hospital and sometimes lost, or in the case of narcotics, stolen. Pancreatic enzymes would be an exception, as they are often difficult to get from pharmacy (and even then the dose is sometimes screwed up). In the case of traumatic injury, if you are hurt seriously enough to be unresponsive, there's a lot of priorities above your medical history and medications for me as a medic. It would be more useful for the emergency department, but after you are stabilized. I can say that in certain cases (especially if a minor is involved) having an "ICE" (In Case of Emergency), "parents," or "home" contact in your kids' phone is handy. Several times I have had kids in accidents and I always try to alert the parents if I have the time. If their condition is not terribly serious, I will also let the parent talk to the child. It can also be useful if your child is out with friends and has a minor injury. For example, your child is out with friends and takes a tumble off a bicycle or something. Someone sees and calls 911. You child might not be injured, or may have a minor sprain or something. Legally, I have to transport him or her to a hospital if no adult is willing to take responsibility and sign a refusal of medical care form. In that case, it's nice to be able to contact a parent to come to scene and let them make the decision (rather than get an $800 bill for a needless ambulance trip). Regarding allergies to medications. First it's important to define "allergy." Many times I'll ask a patient what they are allergic to and they say I'm allergic to medication X. I ask what happens when they take medication X and they will say "it makes me nauseated." That's not an allergy, it's an adverse reaction. An allergic reaction means hives, hypotension and possible airway complications. With that out of the way, let me list many of the medications we carry on an ambulance. That might help some people decide if having their medication allergies listed is warranted. I'll try to list them by category. Respiratory: Albuterol Hydrocortisone sodium succinate Solu-medrol (methylprednisolone) Ipratropium Bromide Magnesium Sulfate (Can be used for bronchospasm. Most of us don't like to use it as it causes a heat rush that often makes patients feel worse) Terbutaline Benzocaine spray (used sometimes for conscious or sedated intubation) Metaproterenol (alupent) (rarely carried anymore, at least here) Cardiac: Nitroglycerine Aspirin Atropine Bretylium Diltiazem (cardizem) Lidocaine Amiodarone Procainamide Verapamil Sodium Bicarbonate Dobutamine Dopamine Calcium Chloride 1:10,000 Epinephrine Furosemide Allergic reactions: Diphenhydramine (benadryl) 1:1000 Epinephrine Solu-medrol Pain: Nitrous Oxide Toradol Fentanyl Morphine Benzocaine tetracaine Nausea: Promethazine (phenergan) Ondansetron (Zofran) Anxiolytics: Midazolam (Versed) Lorazepam (Ativan) Diazepam (Valium) Diabetic: Glucagon D50 (50% dextrose solution) Oral glucose This isn't a complete list, we carry around 60 medications these days. These medications will also vary from state-to-state and region-to-region sometimes, but most of these are very commonly used in most areas. Some also fit into more than one category, but I didn't list them twice.

ETA: Having your kids wear medic alert bracelets might cause them some embarassment (just something to consider).
 
1

1woodswoman

Guest
Jonathan-I've been looking at several medic alert websites, & many have items that are 'nontaditional', like shoe tags for kids (suppose to be less embarressing than bracelet), beads, backpack tags, & other items that aren't on the wrist. Do emergency personnel see or find these alternative Medic ID's, or are they fairly useless to first responders? Is it better to get a more traditional bracelet that can be quickly checked, or are these more alternative type of Medic Alerts found & useful, or are they not beneficial?
 
1

1woodswoman

Guest
Jonathan-I've been looking at several medic alert websites, & many have items that are 'nontaditional', like shoe tags for kids (suppose to be less embarressing than bracelet), beads, backpack tags, & other items that aren't on the wrist. Do emergency personnel see or find these alternative Medic ID's, or are they fairly useless to first responders? Is it better to get a more traditional bracelet that can be quickly checked, or are these more alternative type of Medic Alerts found & useful, or are they not beneficial?
 

Havoc

New member
I think something non-traditional might be very difficult to spot. I, for one, didn't even know they were available, as I've never seen one. So, I wouldn't know to check and that's probably true for most medics or first responders. This would be especially true in a traumatic injury situation where you might be being extricated from a crumpled car and separated from your bag or perhaps lost the shoe with the tag on it (etc). We have had patients with very specific needs actually come to the station (or write a letter) explaining their needs or medical situation. This information is usually posted in the crew room. Of course you have to hope the medic who's pulling a 24 hour shift remembers to associate your name and address with whatever specific problems you have at 4am. I suppose there's really no perfect answer. At the risk of sounding like a broken record, if you are unresponsive, something is very wrong. In that case, we are worried about the basics: Do you have an airway? If so, are you breathing? Do you have a pulse? If so what's your blood pressure? What's your oxygen saturation? What's your Blood Glucose level? Are you bleeding uncontrollably somewhere? Do you have a traumatic brain injury/CVA? Have you had a seizure? In each of those cases we will deal with the problem, but having CF is not going to affect that care and any concerns about CF would be trumped by whatever is causing your unresponsiveness. If it's a respiratory issue, airway and breathing are our #1 and #2 concerns (hence ABC; Airway Breathing and Circulation). So, let's say you have a nasty bronchospasm. I'm going to get your room air oxygen saturation and then stick you on high flow O2 (15LPM) or even assist your respiration with a bag valve mask. If you're bad enough to require assistance one of 2 things is going to happen. If your service has CPAP that is also capable of delivering aerosols, you'll get 5mg of albuterol simultaneously with the CPAP (assuming you don't have a tension pneumo or other contraindication to positive pressure ventilation and assuming that you are conscious, but just can't speak due to respiratory distress). If they don't, I would give the albuterol first and see how you do. At the same time you'll also be getting 1:1000 Epi sub-q or terbutaline sub-q. IV acccess will be obtained and you'll get 125mg Solu-medrol. Then we go back to airway, have things improved? If not, I'm going to be on the phone with a doc discussing whether we should go with something like mag sulfate or more albuterol or rapid sequence endotracheal intubation (a lot of this depends on how long of a transport we have). I really have been racking my brain to think of a situation where a medic alert bracelet might be really beneficial in a pre-hospital setting. I can't come up with much other than an allergy to an extremely common medication, like the ones listed in my previous post. I think they became popular back in the day when EMS was in it's infancy. EMS is not an old profession, at least not civilian EMS. It was invented, as it were, in the late 1700's in Europe for carrying wounded soldiers, scoop and run medicine. As it evolved, ambulance attendants got some training but it was still largely scoop and run. Often the job fell to undertakers who had vehicles that could transport a patient lying prone. It really wasn't until the 60's (at least in the US, Europe and Canada have us beat) that EMS started to become what we know it as today. Even at that, early medics were mostly concerned with cardiac arrest and trauma. This was the time when a medic alert bracelet could make a difference. The medic was some guy who took a 2 week course given by a physician, so not a ton of education. These days, it takes at least 2 years and many of us have 4 year degrees. We are required to take continuing education classes with a varying amount of required hours per year and every 2 years we take ACLS and PALS. Sure, there are bad medics, just like some docs are bad at what they do. You also might live in an area where they only staff EMT's who are only able to deliver basic care (No IVs, no drugs, no EKG etc.). OK, I'll quit rambling. Let me know if that answered your question.
 

Havoc

New member
I think something non-traditional might be very difficult to spot. I, for one, didn't even know they were available, as I've never seen one. So, I wouldn't know to check and that's probably true for most medics or first responders. This would be especially true in a traumatic injury situation where you might be being extricated from a crumpled car and separated from your bag or perhaps lost the shoe with the tag on it (etc). We have had patients with very specific needs actually come to the station (or write a letter) explaining their needs or medical situation. This information is usually posted in the crew room. Of course you have to hope the medic who's pulling a 24 hour shift remembers to associate your name and address with whatever specific problems you have at 4am. I suppose there's really no perfect answer. At the risk of sounding like a broken record, if you are unresponsive, something is very wrong. In that case, we are worried about the basics: Do you have an airway? If so, are you breathing? Do you have a pulse? If so what's your blood pressure? What's your oxygen saturation? What's your Blood Glucose level? Are you bleeding uncontrollably somewhere? Do you have a traumatic brain injury/CVA? Have you had a seizure? In each of those cases we will deal with the problem, but having CF is not going to affect that care and any concerns about CF would be trumped by whatever is causing your unresponsiveness. If it's a respiratory issue, airway and breathing are our #1 and #2 concerns (hence ABC; Airway Breathing and Circulation). So, let's say you have a nasty bronchospasm. I'm going to get your room air oxygen saturation and then stick you on high flow O2 (15LPM) or even assist your respiration with a bag valve mask. If you're bad enough to require assistance one of 2 things is going to happen. If your service has CPAP that is also capable of delivering aerosols, you'll get 5mg of albuterol simultaneously with the CPAP (assuming you don't have a tension pneumo or other contraindication to positive pressure ventilation and assuming that you are conscious, but just can't speak due to respiratory distress). If they don't, I would give the albuterol first and see how you do. At the same time you'll also be getting 1:1000 Epi sub-q or terbutaline sub-q. IV acccess will be obtained and you'll get 125mg Solu-medrol. Then we go back to airway, have things improved? If not, I'm going to be on the phone with a doc discussing whether we should go with something like mag sulfate or more albuterol or rapid sequence endotracheal intubation (a lot of this depends on how long of a transport we have). I really have been racking my brain to think of a situation where a medic alert bracelet might be really beneficial in a pre-hospital setting. I can't come up with much other than an allergy to an extremely common medication, like the ones listed in my previous post. I think they became popular back in the day when EMS was in it's infancy. EMS is not an old profession, at least not civilian EMS. It was invented, as it were, in the late 1700's in Europe for carrying wounded soldiers, scoop and run medicine. As it evolved, ambulance attendants got some training but it was still largely scoop and run. Often the job fell to undertakers who had vehicles that could transport a patient lying prone. It really wasn't until the 60's (at least in the US, Europe and Canada have us beat) that EMS started to become what we know it as today. Even at that, early medics were mostly concerned with cardiac arrest and trauma. This was the time when a medic alert bracelet could make a difference. The medic was some guy who took a 2 week course given by a physician, so not a ton of education. These days, it takes at least 2 years and many of us have 4 year degrees. We are required to take continuing education classes with a varying amount of required hours per year and every 2 years we take ACLS and PALS. Sure, there are bad medics, just like some docs are bad at what they do. You also might live in an area where they only staff EMT's who are only able to deliver basic care (No IVs, no drugs, no EKG etc.). OK, I'll quit rambling. Let me know if that answered your question.
 

azdesertrat

New member
When I'm out travelling by myself (I do that quite often) I wear a set of dogtags. One is red & has medical info & emergency ph #'s on it.
The specific med info is as follows: DIABETIC DOUBLE LUNG TRANS and on the bottom line is 2 emergency contacts.
If you suffer frequent low blood sugars I would strongly reccomend wearing a dogtag or a bracelet. It is very important that EMS has as much info as possible.
Best of luck to you, 'Pat'.
 

azdesertrat

New member
When I'm out travelling by myself (I do that quite often) I wear a set of dogtags. One is red & has medical info & emergency ph #'s on it.
The specific med info is as follows: DIABETIC DOUBLE LUNG TRANS and on the bottom line is 2 emergency contacts.
If you suffer frequent low blood sugars I would strongly reccomend wearing a dogtag or a bracelet. It is very important that EMS has as much info as possible.
Best of luck to you, 'Pat'.
 
1

1woodswoman

Guest
Jonathan-
Thanks for all the info.! The details you provide are quite thorough.

As you described the "old days", I remembered a friend of the family from when I was growing up, who was a "swoop & scoop" ambulance driver in the '50's & early '60's. He used the say his job was just to get patients to the hospital as fast as possible. Then there was my ex-husband who was a paramedic in the early '70's, who had only a 6 week course, & minimal cue's to stay certified through the late '70's. It's good to hear that times have changed!

Just curious, if a medical alert bracelet says DNR, is that honored by first responders, or at the ER, or do they wait until a DNR form is presented by a family member or primary care doctor?
 
1

1woodswoman

Guest
Jonathan-
Thanks for all the info.! The details you provide are quite thorough.

As you described the "old days", I remembered a friend of the family from when I was growing up, who was a "swoop & scoop" ambulance driver in the '50's & early '60's. He used the say his job was just to get patients to the hospital as fast as possible. Then there was my ex-husband who was a paramedic in the early '70's, who had only a 6 week course, & minimal cue's to stay certified through the late '70's. It's good to hear that times have changed!

Just curious, if a medical alert bracelet says DNR, is that honored by first responders, or at the ER, or do they wait until a DNR form is presented by a family member or primary care doctor?
 

Havoc

New member
No, I must have signed paperwork in my hand to honor an OOHDNR (out of hospital do not resuscitate). I have had cases where I was forced to do CPR/ACLS because they did not have the DNR form on hand.

Most people keep them on the fridge with a magnet, we usually look there if the patient is alone and in arrest. The hospital will also not honor anything that's not in your record, they also must have the paperwork or a medical power of attorney present to give the order to stop resuscitation efforts.
 

Havoc

New member
No, I must have signed paperwork in my hand to honor an OOHDNR (out of hospital do not resuscitate). I have had cases where I was forced to do CPR/ACLS because they did not have the DNR form on hand.

Most people keep them on the fridge with a magnet, we usually look there if the patient is alone and in arrest. The hospital will also not honor anything that's not in your record, they also must have the paperwork or a medical power of attorney present to give the order to stop resuscitation efforts.
 
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