Soil and CF?

[momofcfprincess]

What are your thoughts on being around soil, sandboxes, gardens? Thank you

 

[AleksandraKaczynska]

wash hands, keep eyes and mouth safe from it, if the child gets dirty - change clothes or take a bath

 

[Ratatosk]

DS has played in sandboxes at daycare, has helped his dad plant trees, plays in the sand at the lake; however, I don't really let him help me plant stuff in the garden. Mainly because we use the leaves from last fall to cover up our garden as well as composted manure when we till up the garden. Who knows what's growing there after 6-8 months of sitting fallow. I also get a tad uneasy about composting. My inlaws have a countertop compost container at the lake and I'm forever reminding them to empty it and rinse it out because otherwise, despite the charcoal filter the coffee grounds, veggie and fruit peelings start to break down and get smelling, possibly moldy. I stopped composting as well when ds was born.

 

[ymikhale]

i don't let my dd put her hands in soil etc. For us it is relatively easy since we live in a city, if you have a house and a garden that might be more difficult.

 

[Aboveallislove]

We also don't do, but were on the more cautious end of the spectrum. The cff recent guidelines recommended cf not do activities that result in dust from soil because of aspergillosis sp? Not sure what they meant by those activities, but will be asking not appointment since our center sent that out.

 

[BikerEd]

I'm 42, I have CF. I work in transportation construction. We move a lot of soil. Prior to going over to the transportation division I was a GeoTech. In addition to construction material inspection and testing I specialized in soil identification, soil stabilization, soil mechanics and foundations. It's a dirty job but somebody has to do it. (ZINGER! See what I did there). God made dirt, dirt don't hurt. The thing to avoid are molds. Late fall early spring, you can still happily play in material with decomposing leaves grass etc etc by wearing a simple mask, or even a bandana (and who doesn't like looking like a train robber from the Wild West). Sand boxes pose no threat unless a cat is constantly crapping in it as your playing in it. I have a garden and do my own planting, if I use compose I wear a dust mask as should anyone CF or not. Manufactured top soil I do not worry about. So long story short in my non-medical opinion, let her play, let her make mud pies, let her throw dirt clods, and come home in your favorite outfit covered in mud it's part of being a kid. And like any rational person when she is done have her wash her hands change her clothes put on an eye patch and pretend to be a pirate looking for buried treasure.

Best of Luck

Ed

 

[windex125]

I am pretty sure MAC comes from soil and water??? Pat-CF

 

[Ratatosk]

Agree with Ed. Wash hands, remind them to avoid hand to mouth/nose contact. Let them be kids. Frankly, I was more worried about the gum ds told me he found at the playground than anything else. And really, what can I do hours after the fact. ewwwww!

 

[BikerEd]

YES and NO Pat. MAC is ubiquitous in distribution. It has been isolated from fresh water and salt water worldwide. The common environmental sources of MAC include the following:

• Aerosolized water
  
• Piped hot water systems (including household and hospital water supplies)
  
• Bathrooms[SUP] [/SUP]
  
• House dust
  
• Soil
  
• Birds
  
• Farm animals
  
  So short of wearing the a space suit your exposed to it everywhere. shower heads contain Psuedo that's why I soak mine in vinegar and change my showerhead every six months.
  

 

[BreathinSteven]

I've understood that there is a risk (though probably small) of cepacia -- as it is a soil borne bug:

http://cysticfibrosis.about.com/od/relateddiseases/tp/bcepacia.htm

I always wonder about little ones and soil / dirt / sandboxes -- I was raised playing in all of them... I know that many of us have issues with our immune systems -- but I always wonder if exposures such as soil & sandboxes & other bug-laden children exercises our immune systems... We hear theories about all of the drive towards anti-bacterial agents and keeping all of us "protected" actually developing resistant strains, AND hampering our immune systems when we're not continually exposed to the bugs our parents and grandparents and beyond were exposed... And -- I don't know how all of that factors in when we're dealing with a CF patient...

I agree with everyone else about washing hands and decent sanitation practices... Love, Steve

 

[Epona]

Actually, the latest research is showing that in order to develop a healthy immune system, prevent infections, and prevent allergies, we MUST have constant exposure to the bacteria, viruses, fungi, and other pathogens in the environment, especially (healthy) soil. The human microbiome (the ecosystem that lives on and inside of us made up of trillions of bacteria, mostly beneficial) must be deeply immersed in the outdoors, with all its dirt and feces, in order to be strong enough to protect us from infection and in order to train the immune system not to over-react when harmless things enter our bodies (i.e. allergies). I have zero allergies and my immune system was relatively strong as a kid because my mom encouraged me to be outside all the time and to get dirty and to play with other animals. I am outside and dirty as much as possible now (gardening, being in the woods everyday, playing with non-human animals) and my immune system is getting stronger (at least in response to viruses). I grow some of my own food and try to leave at least a little bit of dirt on my vegetables. I thank my mom everyday for her good example. We are animals, and if we do not act like animals by getting dirty regularly (within reason), we begin to get sick. Automimmunity only exists in developed countries where people are too sanitary. The worst of my bugs that inhabit my lungs I've caught from the hospital, not the environment. Pseudo, other bacteria, and molds are everywhere and we are constantly exposed to them - it is almost impossible to avoid. However, if we help our immune systems be as strong as they possibly can be by living in a natural way, we can help prevent infection. CFers of course always must be super careful about catching germs from other humans in hospitals, doctors' offices, and enclosed public spaces (like airplanes), but I never worry about catching germs from the environment, unless I'm in a dirty place like a city or a moldy basement. "Germ theory" is now quickly giving way to the "Hygiene Hypothesis", which understands that we can boost our immunity by living in certain ways and eating certain things (like fermented foods) to help the beneficial species that live inside us remain strong. Kids that live on farms are statistically much healthier and disease-free than kids that live in cities. For more info on the growing body of science behind this, listen to: http://chriskresser.com/what-are-the-hidden-costs-of-modern-hygiene

 

[Gobae]

I agree with Epona. Other than common hygiene (hand washing, sneezing/coughing into elbow or tissue, etc) and not exposing our CF granddaughter to overly dusty/smoky environments she does everything (and more) that a typical kids does. By this I mean she's not excluded from sandboxes, helping us plant in the garden or playing with the dog and cats. She has no allergies and she rarely catches so much as a cold. Of course this is all anecdotal and YMMV but I strongly believe part of the reason she is doing so well is her high activity level and her exposure to everyday allergens/pathogens.

 

[jennywotherspoon]

Another one in agreement here. My daughter with CF has been raised on farms with daily interaction with horses, dogs, outdoors, sand dressage arenas and dirt and camping in the bush. We practice good hygiene, handwashing before meals, medications and treatments. She has always been allowed to get out into the natural environment without fear. On the other hand we are super careful and fastidious when out in public places, clinic, no hot tubs and public pools. etc and we do everything in our power to prevent picking up bacteria in these environments. We have one very healthy nearly twenty year old daughter and I am grateful that we have allowed her to live her life to the full without being afraid to experience an active outdoor life, dirt and all.

 

[ponytails]

Our cf dr advises against letting kids with cf garden. Most of the bugs we worry about come from the natural environment. Cepacia, pseudomonas, aspergillus, mycobacterium all are naturally occuring. So I'm on the opposite side. I have no problem taking her ice skating, the movies, ammusement parks. But we avoid gardening, farms, standing water, playing in dirt/mud, etc. Although I agree with being totally protective while at clinic.