Terri Schaivo

vickysmommy

New member
Not trying to argue or anything but thats exactly what they are doing, killing her isnt it? They are brudely murdering her in my opinion and its not right, its the same as torture. If I was being tortured I would rather just die
 
I

IG

Guest
This argument is classified as a definitional argument.
You have to define murder.
Murder to you might be relief to the next person.
Some people might view it as helping her escape from the pain.
All in all it still falls back on your own personal morals, and opinions.
Personal Opinion: I'd hate to be in that state, because we don't know exactly how far gone Terri Schaivo is, but I have a feeling it's pretty far gone. To me after Terri married her husband her parents gave up rights to her. Now he could have divorced her, but he has stuck by her side for the past 15 years trying to see that what she wanted to happen is done. That's my opinion, I know several of you don't agree. That's ok. I don't agree with several of you either. Unfortunately, this topic is super sensitive. A lot of issues are now adays. Including that of embryonic stem cell, another topic that a lot of you don't agree on. Why? Morals, personal opinions, and the like. Unfortunately with those other topics we usually end with the topic being turned into an argument or locked. I'd like to see this one continued, because it's rather interesting to see what you think but I don't think that can happen if it turns into an argument.
 

ClashPunk82

New member
I hope I didn't start anythig. I was just curious as to how people felt on this and knwoing that we might be faced with the same dilema and how we would want it. I personally am going to make a living will soon and sit down with my parents family and boyfriend and tell them exactly what I want so it will not get to the point of it turning into a Terri case. And since I am being evaluated for a transplant the doctor suggested to me that it was a good idea to do so I am going to take her adviise and do it.
 
I

IG

Guest
Actually I think it is a good topic, it made me think. A living will is probably something that I have to do I believe, just to be on the safe side.
<img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif" border="0">
I'd rather not see the topic locked though.
 

JennaB

New member
I agree with the majority. I don't think she should have to live like this, but starving her is not the way to do it.

Here is a link to a CAT scan done on Terri in '96.
http://img217.exs.cx/img217/8978/catscan8cg.jpg

Here is a picture of a normal CAT scan.
http://img33.exs.cx/img33/2302/13small0im.jpg
 

Dustin82

New member
I have been trying to follow this whole story and they said that Michael went to school to be a nurse and everything to help Terri which showed that he wanted her to live. There were treatment going on to get her to talk and other things. One day he cuts everything off. I hate saying this but I think he found out the money that he would get after she pasted on. I mean if someone was willing to take care of someone like her parents want to do why wouldnt u say great and let them do it. I mean they said that Michael has moved on 2 kids and all. What is he telling his kids? If u ask me Michael is cheating on she wife. It is not like she is on life support. She is breathing on her own. There are alot of people that are in this state and have came out of it or atleast can talk. The thing that I think about the most is if they put the feeding tube back in and parent got to take care of her and they got back to the state where she could talk again dont u wonder what she would say about Michael u know how much of what he is saying is true and what is false? But we may never know which is sad.... All we can do now is just keep them in are heart and in are prays they need them now more then ever <img src="i/expressions/rose.gif" border="0">
 
L

luke

Guest
I have only been watching major media coverage and haven't got into the nuiances of the case. I did watch parts of Shaivo and his lawyer when they were on Larry King. Accordiing to the lawyer there isn't any money to gain so we can remove that. I do think legally....Shiavo is in the right, he has husband(in good standing at the time of her accident) has the power of attorney and has a right to carry out his wifes wishes. Ethically, I also agee for someone to have the right to die. The only real problem I have with the case is that Shiavo went out and got a girlfriend and a couple kids while his wife was in the nursing home. I belive that his morality of his respecting his wifes decision becomes in question because of his poor sexual decisons. Finally, as a Healthcare proffesional I can say I have seen many patients in this condition and it is a miserable way to exist. I support Terri Shiavo's right to die even if her parents do not.


luke
 

anonymous

New member
To address what Candice mentioned in her previous post. I don't think he could have divorced her without her consent, which she obviously can't give, so I don't think he has necessarily "stood by her side for 15 years". He probably can't legally divorce her without her signing the papers as far as I know....I could be wrong. I have been before & will be again.
And in my humble opinion, conceiving 2 children and having a common law wife isn't my idea of standing by anyone's side either.
I bet he had good intentions in the beginning that they would beat this together, but then lost hope as the months/years went by w/ little or no change in her condition and moved on. Again....just speculation, no offense was meant to anyone.<img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif" border="0">
LJ
 

NoDayButToday

New member
Actually, I believe he could have divorced her after a certain period of time even without her consent, sort of like a person can divorce a spouse who is in jail for a certain amount of time.
 

anonymous

New member
I really want to share on the whole isue of Terri's husband being with another woman and having children. It seems that quite a long time ago he lost faith in the fact that his wife would ever come around. Initially, he did do everything in his power to get a nursing degree and was by her side non-stop. Then there came a point, after much testing and CAT scans and such that it seems he concluded regardless of how much he wished for her to come around, it just wasn't medically possible. And yes there are miracles everyday, but you have to draw the line somewhere. That is when he started pushing to take her off everything artificial and let her go. Then came in the parents to fight the entire thing. To me, this situation reminds me of a story from the bible, in a way.

There is a situation where two different mothers are claiming that one baby is theirs. It goes on and on and on this way for a while. Then somebody concludes that the only thing to do is cut the baby in half and give each half to each mother since it can't be determined which woman is telling the truth. One mother agrees, the next says "don't do that, just give her the baby". Now, who do you think the real mother is, the one who really cares about the baby? Certainly not the mother who is willing to let the baby suffer and cut it in half. And I feel that suffering is exactly what her parents are letting her do. When she got married, I believe that her parents no longer have a say in what happens to her since she has a husband. I would certainly be mad, and feel the way her husband seems to feel if my husband's parents came in and said "let him live, do all you can" because that is NOT what my husband has expressed to me he wants. Has my husband ever talked about this with his parents, no. Why, that is his issue, but I am the one who ultimately has the say, he has intrusted me to do the right thing with his wishes. And I believe that is only what her husband is doing here.

To him, Terri has probably been "dead" for a long time. She can't return love, emotion, hugging and touching; she can't communicate; and she is virtually brain dead with no signs of ever recovering. I personally would not "move on", even though my husband might die before me (although it might be my time first) I won't ever remarry or move on to somebody else; this is just the way I choose to live my life. I only have one love and that is all I ever want. But, I can understand what her husband did. He didn't start dating other women until he decided that his wife probably wasn't going to come around, it's not like he was out dating a week later. Why should he sit around being miserable when there is the opportunity for him to find new companinonship out there. And yes, I believe he could have divorced her, but then he would have given up the right to say what be done with her concerning her medical care. It seems to me that regardless of everything else going on in his life- it still seems VERY important to him to have a say in what happens to his wife. I can only imagine that he is fulfilling a promise to her that if something ever happened to her, he would carry out her wishes.

Just my few thoughts,

Julie (wife to mark 24 w/CF)
 

S

New member
<blockquote>Quote<br><hr>There are alot of people that are in this state and have came out of it or atleast can talk.<hr></blockquote>

No one has ever been in this state for 15 years and recovered...the longest I read about was a man that was in that state for 20 months, this has gone on for over 13 years longer, it's just not going to happen.
 

serendipity730

New member
Julie,
What a perfect analogy! Micheal is certainly the true "mother" in this debacle. I think that even people who feel it is wrong to stop feeding her know deep down that these parents are just being selfish. They want their child - regardless of what state she is in. I think it is awful for a parent to let their child continue suffering just to ease their own. I understand that they want to hold onto hope, but the truth is that there is no hope at this point.
 

anonymous

New member
I saw a lot of suffering working in hospitals and nursing homes. Everyone knows I do not want life support if I have no brain function. When my children are older I will go along with their wishes. I do not want to force something on them because it's what I what. I do not have that right. I have seen people pass in the way this and it is hard to watch but if that is what they want. The first time I was witness to a situation like this it was very upsetting. But I know she and her husband wanted it that way because I had known them since I was a child.
 

S

New member
<blockquote>Quote
<hr>What I don't understand is why they haven't started her on some heavy pain medication, for comfort purposes.<hr></blockquote>

according to a report from the ap she is on morphine.
 

anonymous

New member
I didn't realize that Mary, thanks for the info. I don't mean this to sound crude or offend anyone, but I wonder if her family realizes that a few pushes of the morphine "button" can assist her into comfort-for forever. I too have worked in hospitals and have seen far too much suffering. Family members wishing to keep their sick, dying and in pain family members alive as long as possible because they aren't ready to face it and let go. To me, that is just the most selfish thing I have ever seen in my life. It is a struggle and very difficult to have someone near and dear to you die, but it is more inhumane to keep them in pain because of your own personal issues with death. There is time to heal afterwards. There are nice, comfortable ways to go-it doesn't have to be painful. But it becomes so when family members don't just let it be.

Julie (wife to Mark 24 w/CF)
 

S

New member
my grandmother was in the end stage of cancer and at home being taken care of by family...one night one of them actually tried to give her a dose of morphine that would end her suffering for good, but it didn't work and she passed a few days later. just the fact that they tried shows how much they loved her, it had to be the hardest thing in the world to do and i respect them so much for even attempting it.
 

Mockingbird

New member
I was thinking about this a while ago. On the radio they were playing clips of the parents and the husband arguing weather Terri is trying to say she wants to live, or she's just making weird, unintelligable noises. It got me thinking nobody really knows what's going on inside her head right now. A lot of people say they'd rather be put down at that point, but it makes you wonder if things would change when you actually get there. Hope can be such a weird thing, sometimes it comes out right when things look their bleakest, or sometimes it just stays quiet and lets you accept things to come. Anyway, whenever someone asks me questions like this or mentions an advance directive, or even simpler, asks me how I'll feel about something in the future, i always just say, "I don't know, I'll try to tell you when i get there." I guess that goes along with my personality, though. I never make plans too far ahead because i find life changes too fast. Or like Einstien said, "i never think about the future, it comes soon enough on it's own." At least, I think Einstein said that, I'm relying on a commercial for an anime series on cartoon network for my information, so it might not be entirely correct. =-)

Jarod
22 w/cf
 

anonymous

New member
Jarod, just an FYI cause I am not sure if you knew or not, but you dont' have to put into writing right now EXACTLY what you want when you reach that situation, because you are right, people change their minds. But you can choose a medical power of attorney, a person who you trust that will make medical decisions in the event that you are ever unable to communicate them. You ovbiously want to choose somebody who you are close to and communicate with frequently so you can discuss if your wishes ever change. I am only telling you this because I have seen too many cases of patients who do not have a plan and the decisions that the family has to make, or leave to the hospital to make is just an awful situation to be involved in.

Just an FYI, not trying to cause any problems.

Julie (wife to Mark 24 w/CF)
 

Dustin82

New member
I guess this sound dumb to others but I am just a redneck dont know much about this even with all the stuff on TV on the health side of it all, but if she did not want to live could she just give up and die with or without the feeding tube? I mean she has lasted along time without food or water.

Like I said I dont know much someone on this subject will tell me could I dont really know just something I was thinking about.<img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif" border="0"> Dustin 23 cf/m
 
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