THE CALL

sassy81172 · Oct 13, 2008

I don't know about where you're from, but I know that in Oklahoma, as a foster parent, you are not allowed to spank. Time-out is the recommendation. It definitely sounds like some definite bonding issues. We were foster parents to our son before we were able to adopt him. Luckily he was only 4 months old, so we did not have a bonding issue. I certainly wish you all the best, and hope that things work out for you. I do agree that you can't risk your health. If it continues to affect your health, you may have to make the difficult decision to give them back. Just remember that if it's not right for you, it's not right for them either!

Sending lots of hugs and prayers your way!!!

sassy81172 · Oct 13, 2008

I don't know about where you're from, but I know that in Oklahoma, as a foster parent, you are not allowed to spank. Time-out is the recommendation. It definitely sounds like some definite bonding issues. We were foster parents to our son before we were able to adopt him. Luckily he was only 4 months old, so we did not have a bonding issue. I certainly wish you all the best, and hope that things work out for you. I do agree that you can't risk your health. If it continues to affect your health, you may have to make the difficult decision to give them back. Just remember that if it's not right for you, it's not right for them either!

Sending lots of hugs and prayers your way!!!

sassy81172 · Oct 13, 2008

I don't know about where you're from, but I know that in Oklahoma, as a foster parent, you are not allowed to spank. Time-out is the recommendation. It definitely sounds like some definite bonding issues. We were foster parents to our son before we were able to adopt him. Luckily he was only 4 months old, so we did not have a bonding issue. I certainly wish you all the best, and hope that things work out for you. I do agree that you can't risk your health. If it continues to affect your health, you may have to make the difficult decision to give them back. Just remember that if it's not right for you, it's not right for them either!

Sending lots of hugs and prayers your way!!!

sassy81172 · Oct 13, 2008

I don't know about where you're from, but I know that in Oklahoma, as a foster parent, you are not allowed to spank. Time-out is the recommendation. It definitely sounds like some definite bonding issues. We were foster parents to our son before we were able to adopt him. Luckily he was only 4 months old, so we did not have a bonding issue. I certainly wish you all the best, and hope that things work out for you. I do agree that you can't risk your health. If it continues to affect your health, you may have to make the difficult decision to give them back. Just remember that if it's not right for you, it's not right for them either!

Sending lots of hugs and prayers your way!!!

sassy81172 · Oct 13, 2008

I don't know about where you're from, but I know that in Oklahoma, as a foster parent, you are not allowed to spank. Time-out is the recommendation. It definitely sounds like some definite bonding issues. We were foster parents to our son before we were able to adopt him. Luckily he was only 4 months old, so we did not have a bonding issue. I certainly wish you all the best, and hope that things work out for you. I do agree that you can't risk your health. If it continues to affect your health, you may have to make the difficult decision to give them back. Just remember that if it's not right for you, it's not right for them either!
 
 Sending lots of hugs and prayers your way!!!

Keepercjr · Oct 13, 2008

Well I totally disagree w/ Haley but that doesn't matter because I'm almost positive she isn't allowed to use any kind of physical punishment on foster children anyway. I can't even imagine the extra damage it would cause when someone they don't know starts out by physically punishing them. Children can be taught how to listen w/o spanking..

Jenny, 3 and 4 is a HARD age no matter what. Then add in what the boys have been through in their short lives. They don't trust anybody (probably have attachment disorders). If you are going to keep them around (and given your health suffering, it may not be a good idea at this point but I don't know..) then you just need to be consistent. Praise them EVERY time you catch them doing something even remotely good ("Oh you're doing such a good job petting the dog nicely" or "You're doing such a good job eating your dinner w/o making a mess" etc). Maybe start up a sticker chart that at the end of so many stickers for good behavior they get a surprise (something from the dollar store would do - even a really cool sticker, etc). Don't yell - breathe through your anger and get down on their level and explain to them (simply) what they did and why it wasn't ok. Use whatever punishment you feel like using (w/in the guidelines of what you are allowed of course). The only "punishment" I use with Logan is taking away something if necessary (or removing him or us from the situation). Boundaries are key and they will test them but if you are consistent every time they will eventually get the message.

Are the boys in any kind of counseling or therapy? I can imagine play therapy would be pretty useful right now. But just know that they are at a tough age. Logan tests my patience on a daily basis - it is just what they do. When the 3yo is in a tantrum biting and kicking - have you tried just holding on to him tightly from behind where he can't hurt you - and just hold him till it is over? Don't say anything (you can't reason w/ an upset child at all) just sit there quietly till it ends. I have been told an excellent book to read is called "The Explosive Child" but I don't know who the author is and if it is relevant in your situation but it wouldn't hurt. I am going to get it myself, hopefully soon.

I'm sorry you're having such a rough time. Don't let your health suffer. You may need to accept that there are children that aren't meant to be in your home. That doesn't mean you'll only accept perfect angels but maybe the boys aren't meant to be with you. Good luck with everything..

Keepercjr · Oct 13, 2008

Well I totally disagree w/ Haley but that doesn't matter because I'm almost positive she isn't allowed to use any kind of physical punishment on foster children anyway. I can't even imagine the extra damage it would cause when someone they don't know starts out by physically punishing them. Children can be taught how to listen w/o spanking..

Jenny, 3 and 4 is a HARD age no matter what. Then add in what the boys have been through in their short lives. They don't trust anybody (probably have attachment disorders). If you are going to keep them around (and given your health suffering, it may not be a good idea at this point but I don't know..) then you just need to be consistent. Praise them EVERY time you catch them doing something even remotely good ("Oh you're doing such a good job petting the dog nicely" or "You're doing such a good job eating your dinner w/o making a mess" etc). Maybe start up a sticker chart that at the end of so many stickers for good behavior they get a surprise (something from the dollar store would do - even a really cool sticker, etc). Don't yell - breathe through your anger and get down on their level and explain to them (simply) what they did and why it wasn't ok. Use whatever punishment you feel like using (w/in the guidelines of what you are allowed of course). The only "punishment" I use with Logan is taking away something if necessary (or removing him or us from the situation). Boundaries are key and they will test them but if you are consistent every time they will eventually get the message.

Are the boys in any kind of counseling or therapy? I can imagine play therapy would be pretty useful right now. But just know that they are at a tough age. Logan tests my patience on a daily basis - it is just what they do. When the 3yo is in a tantrum biting and kicking - have you tried just holding on to him tightly from behind where he can't hurt you - and just hold him till it is over? Don't say anything (you can't reason w/ an upset child at all) just sit there quietly till it ends. I have been told an excellent book to read is called "The Explosive Child" but I don't know who the author is and if it is relevant in your situation but it wouldn't hurt. I am going to get it myself, hopefully soon.

I'm sorry you're having such a rough time. Don't let your health suffer. You may need to accept that there are children that aren't meant to be in your home. That doesn't mean you'll only accept perfect angels but maybe the boys aren't meant to be with you. Good luck with everything..

Keepercjr · Oct 13, 2008

Well I totally disagree w/ Haley but that doesn't matter because I'm almost positive she isn't allowed to use any kind of physical punishment on foster children anyway. I can't even imagine the extra damage it would cause when someone they don't know starts out by physically punishing them. Children can be taught how to listen w/o spanking..

Jenny, 3 and 4 is a HARD age no matter what. Then add in what the boys have been through in their short lives. They don't trust anybody (probably have attachment disorders). If you are going to keep them around (and given your health suffering, it may not be a good idea at this point but I don't know..) then you just need to be consistent. Praise them EVERY time you catch them doing something even remotely good ("Oh you're doing such a good job petting the dog nicely" or "You're doing such a good job eating your dinner w/o making a mess" etc). Maybe start up a sticker chart that at the end of so many stickers for good behavior they get a surprise (something from the dollar store would do - even a really cool sticker, etc). Don't yell - breathe through your anger and get down on their level and explain to them (simply) what they did and why it wasn't ok. Use whatever punishment you feel like using (w/in the guidelines of what you are allowed of course). The only "punishment" I use with Logan is taking away something if necessary (or removing him or us from the situation). Boundaries are key and they will test them but if you are consistent every time they will eventually get the message.

Are the boys in any kind of counseling or therapy? I can imagine play therapy would be pretty useful right now. But just know that they are at a tough age. Logan tests my patience on a daily basis - it is just what they do. When the 3yo is in a tantrum biting and kicking - have you tried just holding on to him tightly from behind where he can't hurt you - and just hold him till it is over? Don't say anything (you can't reason w/ an upset child at all) just sit there quietly till it ends. I have been told an excellent book to read is called "The Explosive Child" but I don't know who the author is and if it is relevant in your situation but it wouldn't hurt. I am going to get it myself, hopefully soon.

I'm sorry you're having such a rough time. Don't let your health suffer. You may need to accept that there are children that aren't meant to be in your home. That doesn't mean you'll only accept perfect angels but maybe the boys aren't meant to be with you. Good luck with everything..

Keepercjr · Oct 13, 2008

Well I totally disagree w/ Haley but that doesn't matter because I'm almost positive she isn't allowed to use any kind of physical punishment on foster children anyway. I can't even imagine the extra damage it would cause when someone they don't know starts out by physically punishing them. Children can be taught how to listen w/o spanking..

Jenny, 3 and 4 is a HARD age no matter what. Then add in what the boys have been through in their short lives. They don't trust anybody (probably have attachment disorders). If you are going to keep them around (and given your health suffering, it may not be a good idea at this point but I don't know..) then you just need to be consistent. Praise them EVERY time you catch them doing something even remotely good ("Oh you're doing such a good job petting the dog nicely" or "You're doing such a good job eating your dinner w/o making a mess" etc). Maybe start up a sticker chart that at the end of so many stickers for good behavior they get a surprise (something from the dollar store would do - even a really cool sticker, etc). Don't yell - breathe through your anger and get down on their level and explain to them (simply) what they did and why it wasn't ok. Use whatever punishment you feel like using (w/in the guidelines of what you are allowed of course). The only "punishment" I use with Logan is taking away something if necessary (or removing him or us from the situation). Boundaries are key and they will test them but if you are consistent every time they will eventually get the message.

Are the boys in any kind of counseling or therapy? I can imagine play therapy would be pretty useful right now. But just know that they are at a tough age. Logan tests my patience on a daily basis - it is just what they do. When the 3yo is in a tantrum biting and kicking - have you tried just holding on to him tightly from behind where he can't hurt you - and just hold him till it is over? Don't say anything (you can't reason w/ an upset child at all) just sit there quietly till it ends. I have been told an excellent book to read is called "The Explosive Child" but I don't know who the author is and if it is relevant in your situation but it wouldn't hurt. I am going to get it myself, hopefully soon.

I'm sorry you're having such a rough time. Don't let your health suffer. You may need to accept that there are children that aren't meant to be in your home. That doesn't mean you'll only accept perfect angels but maybe the boys aren't meant to be with you. Good luck with everything..

Keepercjr · Oct 13, 2008

Well I totally disagree w/ Haley but that doesn't matter because I'm almost positive she isn't allowed to use any kind of physical punishment on foster children anyway. I can't even imagine the extra damage it would cause when someone they don't know starts out by physically punishing them. Children can be taught how to listen w/o spanking..
 
 Jenny, 3 and 4 is a HARD age no matter what. Then add in what the boys have been through in their short lives. They don't trust anybody (probably have attachment disorders). If you are going to keep them around (and given your health suffering, it may not be a good idea at this point but I don't know..) then you just need to be consistent. Praise them EVERY time you catch them doing something even remotely good ("Oh you're doing such a good job petting the dog nicely" or "You're doing such a good job eating your dinner w/o making a mess" etc). Maybe start up a sticker chart that at the end of so many stickers for good behavior they get a surprise (something from the dollar store would do - even a really cool sticker, etc). Don't yell - breathe through your anger and get down on their level and explain to them (simply) what they did and why it wasn't ok. Use whatever punishment you feel like using (w/in the guidelines of what you are allowed of course). The only "punishment" I use with Logan is taking away something if necessary (or removing him or us from the situation). Boundaries are key and they will test them but if you are consistent every time they will eventually get the message.
 
 Are the boys in any kind of counseling or therapy? I can imagine play therapy would be pretty useful right now. But just know that they are at a tough age. Logan tests my patience on a daily basis - it is just what they do. When the 3yo is in a tantrum biting and kicking - have you tried just holding on to him tightly from behind where he can't hurt you - and just hold him till it is over? Don't say anything (you can't reason w/ an upset child at all) just sit there quietly till it ends. I have been told an excellent book to read is called "The Explosive Child" but I don't know who the author is and if it is relevant in your situation but it wouldn't hurt. I am going to get it myself, hopefully soon.
 
 I'm sorry you're having such a rough time. Don't let your health suffer. You may need to accept that there are children that aren't meant to be in your home. That doesn't mean you'll only accept perfect angels but maybe the boys aren't meant to be with you. Good luck with everything..

hopesiris · Oct 14, 2008

Do you have a child psychologist you can consult with? If these children have so many deep seated issues that it would take more time and effort to undo than you can give maybe it's not worth risking your health over. Maybe going with babies is easier in a sense because they are less developed and easier to mold? I'm sorry you are having a hard time, put your health first. That's hard to do as a mom but you have to put your oxygen mask on first and then your kids.

As far as discipline goes, I'd take away favorite toys or privileges for bad behavior and reward good behavior with stickers or whatever you figure out they like. They need to know what the expected behavior is. If they do something in your home that you don't like tell them "we do not do that here".

Are you giving them enough to do? Toddlers need a LOT of stimulation and will act out if they are bored. Make sure they have stuff to do and rotate it frequently (30 mins or less). Trips to parks (with them I'd only do enclosed/gated areas), local Y classes and lots of stuff at home like coloring, finger painting, etc. This is why daycare is so expensive in my opinion-it's tiring work.

Amelia is high need so I have to rotate her activities all day or she gets impossible to deal with. We do mommy and me classes 3 morning a week and then 30 minutes of toddler play time at the Y and on the other two weekdays we do the shopping (she loves cart rides) and sometimes go to the park. Naptime is at home as much as possible and I nap with her when I need to. When we are at home we move from room to room as I clean and take different toys with us.

Also, is the 3 year old on a nap schedule? When you see he is getting tired/fussy you need to put him down before he gets crazy. Sometimes a predictable wake/nap/bedtime schedule helps.

hopesiris · Oct 14, 2008

Do you have a child psychologist you can consult with? If these children have so many deep seated issues that it would take more time and effort to undo than you can give maybe it's not worth risking your health over. Maybe going with babies is easier in a sense because they are less developed and easier to mold? I'm sorry you are having a hard time, put your health first. That's hard to do as a mom but you have to put your oxygen mask on first and then your kids.

As far as discipline goes, I'd take away favorite toys or privileges for bad behavior and reward good behavior with stickers or whatever you figure out they like. They need to know what the expected behavior is. If they do something in your home that you don't like tell them "we do not do that here".

Are you giving them enough to do? Toddlers need a LOT of stimulation and will act out if they are bored. Make sure they have stuff to do and rotate it frequently (30 mins or less). Trips to parks (with them I'd only do enclosed/gated areas), local Y classes and lots of stuff at home like coloring, finger painting, etc. This is why daycare is so expensive in my opinion-it's tiring work.

Amelia is high need so I have to rotate her activities all day or she gets impossible to deal with. We do mommy and me classes 3 morning a week and then 30 minutes of toddler play time at the Y and on the other two weekdays we do the shopping (she loves cart rides) and sometimes go to the park. Naptime is at home as much as possible and I nap with her when I need to. When we are at home we move from room to room as I clean and take different toys with us.

Also, is the 3 year old on a nap schedule? When you see he is getting tired/fussy you need to put him down before he gets crazy. Sometimes a predictable wake/nap/bedtime schedule helps.

hopesiris · Oct 14, 2008

Do you have a child psychologist you can consult with? If these children have so many deep seated issues that it would take more time and effort to undo than you can give maybe it's not worth risking your health over. Maybe going with babies is easier in a sense because they are less developed and easier to mold? I'm sorry you are having a hard time, put your health first. That's hard to do as a mom but you have to put your oxygen mask on first and then your kids.

As far as discipline goes, I'd take away favorite toys or privileges for bad behavior and reward good behavior with stickers or whatever you figure out they like. They need to know what the expected behavior is. If they do something in your home that you don't like tell them "we do not do that here".

Are you giving them enough to do? Toddlers need a LOT of stimulation and will act out if they are bored. Make sure they have stuff to do and rotate it frequently (30 mins or less). Trips to parks (with them I'd only do enclosed/gated areas), local Y classes and lots of stuff at home like coloring, finger painting, etc. This is why daycare is so expensive in my opinion-it's tiring work.

Amelia is high need so I have to rotate her activities all day or she gets impossible to deal with. We do mommy and me classes 3 morning a week and then 30 minutes of toddler play time at the Y and on the other two weekdays we do the shopping (she loves cart rides) and sometimes go to the park. Naptime is at home as much as possible and I nap with her when I need to. When we are at home we move from room to room as I clean and take different toys with us.

Also, is the 3 year old on a nap schedule? When you see he is getting tired/fussy you need to put him down before he gets crazy. Sometimes a predictable wake/nap/bedtime schedule helps.

hopesiris · Oct 14, 2008

Do you have a child psychologist you can consult with? If these children have so many deep seated issues that it would take more time and effort to undo than you can give maybe it's not worth risking your health over. Maybe going with babies is easier in a sense because they are less developed and easier to mold? I'm sorry you are having a hard time, put your health first. That's hard to do as a mom but you have to put your oxygen mask on first and then your kids.

As far as discipline goes, I'd take away favorite toys or privileges for bad behavior and reward good behavior with stickers or whatever you figure out they like. They need to know what the expected behavior is. If they do something in your home that you don't like tell them "we do not do that here".

Are you giving them enough to do? Toddlers need a LOT of stimulation and will act out if they are bored. Make sure they have stuff to do and rotate it frequently (30 mins or less). Trips to parks (with them I'd only do enclosed/gated areas), local Y classes and lots of stuff at home like coloring, finger painting, etc. This is why daycare is so expensive in my opinion-it's tiring work.

Amelia is high need so I have to rotate her activities all day or she gets impossible to deal with. We do mommy and me classes 3 morning a week and then 30 minutes of toddler play time at the Y and on the other two weekdays we do the shopping (she loves cart rides) and sometimes go to the park. Naptime is at home as much as possible and I nap with her when I need to. When we are at home we move from room to room as I clean and take different toys with us.

Also, is the 3 year old on a nap schedule? When you see he is getting tired/fussy you need to put him down before he gets crazy. Sometimes a predictable wake/nap/bedtime schedule helps.

hopesiris · Oct 14, 2008

Do you have a child psychologist you can consult with? If these children have so many deep seated issues that it would take more time and effort to undo than you can give maybe it's not worth risking your health over. Maybe going with babies is easier in a sense because they are less developed and easier to mold? I'm sorry you are having a hard time, put your health first. That's hard to do as a mom but you have to put your oxygen mask on first and then your kids.
 
 As far as discipline goes, I'd take away favorite toys or privileges for bad behavior and reward good behavior with stickers or whatever you figure out they like. They need to know what the expected behavior is. If they do something in your home that you don't like tell them "we do not do that here".
 
 Are you giving them enough to do? Toddlers need a LOT of stimulation and will act out if they are bored. Make sure they have stuff to do and rotate it frequently (30 mins or less). Trips to parks (with them I'd only do enclosed/gated areas), local Y classes and lots of stuff at home like coloring, finger painting, etc. This is why daycare is so expensive in my opinion-it's tiring work.
 
 Amelia is high need so I have to rotate her activities all day or she gets impossible to deal with. We do mommy and me classes 3 morning a week and then 30 minutes of toddler play time at the Y and on the other two weekdays we do the shopping (she loves cart rides) and sometimes go to the park. Naptime is at home as much as possible and I nap with her when I need to. When we are at home we move from room to room as I clean and take different toys with us.
 
 Also, is the 3 year old on a nap schedule? When you see he is getting tired/fussy you need to put him down before he gets crazy. Sometimes a predictable wake/nap/bedtime schedule helps.

hbollotte · Oct 14, 2008

i hope no one thinks i'm a bad mother for spanking. there are just different ways to deal with children. around here we still have schools that use paddles. i guess it's a southern thing? not sure.

also i guess i wasn't taking into consideration about them being foster kids. sorry.

hbollotte · Oct 14, 2008

i hope no one thinks i'm a bad mother for spanking. there are just different ways to deal with children. around here we still have schools that use paddles. i guess it's a southern thing? not sure.

also i guess i wasn't taking into consideration about them being foster kids. sorry.

hbollotte · Oct 14, 2008

i hope no one thinks i'm a bad mother for spanking. there are just different ways to deal with children. around here we still have schools that use paddles. i guess it's a southern thing? not sure.

also i guess i wasn't taking into consideration about them being foster kids. sorry.

hbollotte · Oct 14, 2008

i hope no one thinks i'm a bad mother for spanking. there are just different ways to deal with children. around here we still have schools that use paddles. i guess it's a southern thing? not sure.

also i guess i wasn't taking into consideration about them being foster kids. sorry.

hbollotte · Oct 14, 2008

i hope no one thinks i'm a bad mother for spanking. there are just different ways to deal with children. around here we still have schools that use paddles. i guess it's a southern thing? not sure.
 
 also i guess i wasn't taking into consideration about them being foster kids. sorry.

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