ok I don't want to start anything here...read if you like

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Scarlett81

New member
Listen Sean,

You are a nice intelligent guy. I didn't mean to knock your core. As you stated men and women differ greatly, and it hit hard at my estrogen, that's all.
It's a very touchy topic. And, I don't come on here to only read the posts of people that agree with me. That's actually one of the reasons I did bring it up. I wanted to see if there was someone else that thought that way too.

Regardless, no hard feelings, and I hope the same with you. And I thank you for writing in, and please continue if you have any more thoughts.

You always keep my interest whether I agree w you or not, and when I see SeanDavis on a post, I always wonder-what's he gonna say?!

PS-Were you trying to tell us something about some "manly" temptations you are having? J/K
 
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Faust

New member
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote><i>Originally posted by: <b>Scarlett81</b></i>

Listen Sean,



You are a nice intelligent guy. I didn't mean to knock your core. As you stated men and women differ greatly, and it hit hard at my estrogen, that's all.

It's a very touchy topic. And, I don't come on here to only read the posts of people that agree with me. That's actually one of the reasons I did bring it up. I wanted to see if there was someone else that thought that way too.



Regardless, no hard feelings, and I hope the same with you. And I thank you for writing in, and please continue if you have any more thoughts.



You always keep my interest whether I agree w you or not, and when I see SeanDavis on a post, I always wonder-what's he gonna say?!



PS-Were you trying to tell us something about some "manly" temptations you are having? J/K</end quote></div>

Heh yeah no problems. I highly doubt I would ever have any real issues on here with anyone (besides one person from a while back that seemed to have brain damage), because I grew up on a site where telling each other to die a horrible death in a fire was a common greeting.

As far as my manly temptations...In my opinion, no matter how gorgeous a guys girl is, and no matter how in love with her he is, we will always have that biological "spread thou seed" desire deep within us. It doesn't mean we have to act on it, i'm just saying, comparitively, how women have strong maternal instrincts, men have strong roaming instincts. And what's amazing about our traits, is that it maks 100% sound sense when looking at it from a biological diversity standpoint. We just haven't been able to evolve out of it (men for ours, women for theirs), even though technology and society have drastically moved forward past those basic urges. I'm not a cheater, and despise guys who cheat on their women, but I do acknowlege the eternal reasons why we have roaming eyes. I think if women understood and accepted how we were made, and have been this way since we were officially humans, reactions from women regarding our tendencies wouldn't be as negative. I guess the problem is that men aren't biologically predisposed to fit into a marriage monogomous relationship. So we are basically trying to put a square block where a triangle should be, and just force it into place.

This is why it's so cruel to be a guy in our society. I love being a guy, but I wish I could get rid of those primal desires of lookin at (and having thoughts of) "New booty" so to speak. If that drug came out tomorrow, men would be 100000000% more effecient in their jobs and daily activities.
 
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anonymous

New member
I don't have CF, but DS does. We waited until we were ready to have kids -- late 30s and always intended to have at least two kids. Big surprise when DS was born with a blockage due to CF. Kinda thru a wrench in the whole, having another kid scenario. DH and I discussed throwing caution to the wind and taking our chances (25%) of having another kid wcf. Discussed PGD and IVF -- but costs involved... And I know some people have gotten insurance to pay for PGD, but I'm almost 40. We can adopt -- we have options.... While it'd be great if DS could have some siblings, we'd rather focus time, money, energy on him, his needs, keeping him happy and healthy. We haven't closed the door on the idea of more children -- we've thought long and hard about this. But here's the thing. DH and I can make this decision -- risk having another kid wcf... or whatever we decide. But swear to god -- someone else offers their opinion -- friends, family, coworker, complete stranger. I tend to get a little defensive and cranky about the whole thing. Touchy subject that even I can't answer, but someone else offers their opinion.... Grrr! Liza
 
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Faust

New member
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote><i>Originally posted by: <b>Scarlett81</b></i>

interesting..i'm just letting this all soak in for a minute</end quote></div>


This will eventually degrade into quite a few women in relationships saying "omg not all guys are like that!", and "My guy isn't like that!", and many variations on those two points. There might also be other guys post that they aren't like that, maybe because their lady asked them if they were like that, and in order to not be in the doghouse, told her no and she wanted him to post here in this thread to tell me he's not like that, which in turn ease her paranoia. That's when I stop responding, because it's a discussion of science vs emotions, and that's an argument you can't make any headway in.


Sorry to derail the thread, I just went off on a tangent to illustrate the differences in men and womens strong biological urges.
 
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Emily65Roses

New member
Wanted to throw my two cents in...

SeanDavis is right, we do have a natural instinct to want to have kids. Not our fault, or purposeful because it's an "ovary thing." But at the same time, that doesn't mean it needs to be ignored. I very much want to be a mother someday and thoroughly plan on doing it. If you want to agree with Sean's route of saying the world is overpopulated and there are too many unwanted kids (I happen to agree, btw), then adopt! You still get to be a parent, and that's what it's all about in the end.

As for being selfish because we're going to die... ehhhh. I don't like the topic much myself because I have an opinion on it but it doesn't have a whole lot of logic or reasoning behind it, in my head. I say have kids, do what you want. I will probably die young (relative term, but you guys get the idea), but I still plan on having a child or two. Yes, it will be traumatic for them. It's also traumatic to Mike, who I'll be leaving a widower. Only difference is that Mike knows all this and has chosen to stay. Kids don't choose to be born to sick parents. (Course here you could argue that he didn't really choose. He fell in love with me and therefore stays, regardless of the circumstances. He didn't seek out a CFer thinking "Hmmm, I'd really like to fall for a dying chick, let's find one"). But if it's important to you, if it's what you really want in life, do it. Being a loving parent knowing your health is precarious is a lot less selfish than pregnant mothers who smoke, or mothers who smoke around their children, mothers who ignore their kids, or let the boyfriend beat them, etc etc etc. I could go on and on. There are lots of examples that happen a lot more frequently than CF people choosing to have children, despite knowing their health is on the fence.

I also agree with whoever it was that said nearly everyone who wants kids is doing it for a selfish reason one way or another. I intend to be the best mother I can be, but in the end, I want kids because <b>I</b> <i>want</i> to be a mother. And because <b>I</b> <i>want</i> Mike to be a father (so does he, mind you, I'm not forcing it on him hahaha). I want us to be parents together, I want us to be a family. So in the end, it's about what I want, what Mike wants.

I've wondered about the subject before myself. There's no answer. I think it's not the most ideal situation, but I don't think it's wrong.

And as for anyone who tells you it's selfish or judges you... seriously tell them to mind their own effing business. Or get CF/other terminal illness they've lived with their whole life before talking to you about it again.

Like men who talk about not having post-partum, or abortions... no ovaries? No uterus? No vagina? Then sorry, but your opinion does <u>not</u> count for much. Especially if you're judgmental.
Not sick? Not dying? Not a CFer? <u>No opinion.</u>
You can't really say until you've been there. And if you're being a judgmental jackass about a very "grey area" issue without actually being there, then you can rot in hell.
 
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EnergyGal

New member
If someone would every speak to me that way, I would simply say, excuse me,, Life is a Legacy. That should get them to think
Risa
 
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S

New member
or you could do what i did. my girlfriend and i weren't even thinking about having a baby, hell, we'd only been together for 6 months when this surprise popped up. the funny thing was that i found out i could create children naturally just a couple weeks before my girlfriend got pregnant. i remember my doctor saying "well, now you KNOW you gotta be careful." sure did listen, didn't i? so just let it happen "accidentally", then it's not selfish at all <img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif" border="0">
 
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Faust

New member
Heh good thing i'm shootin blanks...If it wasn't for me being sterile due to CF, man i'd probably have a ton of kids running around. Scary.
 
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JazzysMom

New member
Sometime last year (I think) there was an anonymous poster causing problems (surprise, surprise) & degrading us for "multiplying" & spreading the illness etc etc etc. The person reminded me of those white surpremess (sp?) groups that were trying to make the "perfect" world. My mother did not agree with my pregnancy. She just about had me dead & buried & her raising my baby........Surprise....it didnt go that way at this point. I think if both parents are understanding of the future & are willing to take it on the they need to "live" which includes having children. Adoption isnt for everyone. Sadly its a fact. Pregnancy isnt for all CFers. Sadly its a fact. It is a difficult decision to think about your child being left with only one parent. My Dad died 6 days before my 17th birthday & guess what....He didnt have CF. What do you know....Life throws us curve balls! Christian, Do what you & hubby feel are best for you. Dr. Walker will support you either way. She might not be happy about it, but she wont leave your side.
 
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Jane

Digital opinion leader
Christian,
People are just plain ignorant, rude and nosy. It is no one's business what you plan to do. People told me that I was selfish choosing to have a second child after my first was diagnosed with cf. One of those people was my mom.

Who knows what kind of parents we will be, or for how long ? Who decides what's fair? Is it fair that crack-addicts or work-aholics or criminals have kids? What about gay people, people from other countries, people with red hair.....

Who knows. It's up to you.

Jane
 
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LisaV

New member
Hard to know what to say about this one.
You want to decide based on "the best interest of the child" not based on your own need alone. (And sometimes some girs/women do have kids just to meet their own needs. Studies have shown that "feeling completely unloved and neglected" is often the reason that young teenagers get pregnant, carry to term, and choose to try to raise their child - even tho' they're too young to really raise their kid and their mother has to take over.)

Obviously, the best interest of the child is not to become an orphan so probably not at all wise to get pregnant if the medicos think it will be the death of you.

But it's equally obvious that its in the best interest of the child to be born in the first place.

And very nice to be raised to a couple who has gone out of their way to make you and thinks you're the biggest gift they ever got.

Tough individual choice.

Best not to ask other people's advice tho' if you don't want it. My sister-in-law asked her brother (my husband) if he thought she and her husband should have more kids (this after the 1st 2 were born with CF and the third with another condition). I think he tried to temporarize by saying something like "well, with your genes you guys would be taking a real risk". And, of course, in the next breath she got all bent out of shape and then told him she was pregnant. Didn't he feel the fool. (4th kid is in perfect health by the way.)

Very touchy subject in our family with 3 identified hereditary conditions. ....
 
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Emily65Roses

New member
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote><i>Originally posted by: <b>amy</b></i>
CF people know the time and effort it takes to be healthy. Or just to keep up. And I think that putting a kid in that situation is selfish and wrong. When you have a kid, you know, as a CF parent, that you can't devote as much time to kid that you would if you didn't have CF.</end quote></div>

Only point I want to make on this... Yes Ahava lost her father when she was very young, and will always miss him. But as to devoting time to her while he was alive, he gave her more time than most fathers because he didn't work. He stayed home all day. Not debating your POV, just wanted to give that example, because it's a good one.

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote><i>Originally posted by: <b>amy</b></i>My FEV1's are 99% and I'm 24. Why? Cuz I do meds for 4 hours a day, exercise for another 1, and sleep 9 hours at LEAST at night to stay healthy. </end quote></div>

All of that has a lot to do with why you're still doing so well. But it's also a matter of luck, and people seem to forget that. Good for you that you're still at 99%, and keep it going. Just had to say. It's not my fault I'm at 65-70%. Bugs just happened to find me sooner than you.
 
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Emily65Roses

New member
I didn't say it was. Read the first sentence in that part of the reply.
"All of that has a lot to do with why you're still doing so well."
Luck is <i>a part</i> of it.
 
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Faust

New member
As we all know, CF progression has to do with MANY factors, of those, the major ones are: Mutation(s), compliance with treatment, how often you use clearance, supplement use, luck, environment, work environment, exhaustion, work/disability, religious with aresol use, outlook, and non mutated genes from parents, and many other factors.


But yes, as we all know, if everything else is equal, someone who doesn't take good care of themself vs someone who does, the one who does will have a large advantage in living longer than the one who doesn't take care of themself.
 
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katyf13

New member
Taking care of yourself does have a lot to do with it, but not everything. Mike's at 21% and in the hospital and he happens to do a great job taking care of himself. *shakes fist at sky and curses cf*

I of course want to have a kiddo someday, Mike's on the fence. I wouldn't even consider it until after he is transplanted, and we have had plenty of time with just the two of us to enjoy life with fresh new lungs! So even though it's years away and undecided, I want a kid, not because it's what I"m "supposed to do" but because I think we'd be good at it and our family would be freakin' awesome!!

Oh and I think it's not a doctor's place to frown upon someone having a child because the child would lose a parent. It's their place to think about the care and health of their patient, not make judgements about what could be. If you have a lot of love to give, and your heart and soul are in it, and there are a lot of loving people and support involved, then be a parent. Being left a single parent or a kid with one parent would be tough, but I think most would not change their decision! I work with familes and most of them are non-traditional, but still very loving and happy, despite all kinds of losses.
 
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