The Presidential Debates

[Mockingbird]

I can't believe I'm hearing this. You're basically advocating a totalitarian society.

A small group of elite people makes all the decisions for the majority; that's what you're saying right? And what happens when the "dumb majority" doesn't accept your rule? You'll force them to accept it, because as the intelligent elite, you know better than they do what's best for them.

This has played out in history before, and it always ends the same way. The founding fathers of this counrty dveloped our system of government specifically to avoid this.

"We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. - That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed"

What you are saying goes against the very fabric of this nation. I realize you don't believe in God, but this country is founded on the principle that everyone is a unique, fearful, and wonderful creation, and they are to have equal rights, whether you think they are dumb or not. Furthermore, it is not government's role to be a power above the people, but rather it derives its power from the consent of the people. That's what was written in the Declaration of Independence, and (even though you're probably going to call me stupid for saying so) I believe it still holds true today.

 

[Mockingbird]

I can't believe I'm hearing this. You're basically advocating a totalitarian society.

A small group of elite people makes all the decisions for the majority; that's what you're saying right? And what happens when the "dumb majority" doesn't accept your rule? You'll force them to accept it, because as the intelligent elite, you know better than they do what's best for them.

This has played out in history before, and it always ends the same way. The founding fathers of this counrty dveloped our system of government specifically to avoid this.

"We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. - That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed"

What you are saying goes against the very fabric of this nation. I realize you don't believe in God, but this country is founded on the principle that everyone is a unique, fearful, and wonderful creation, and they are to have equal rights, whether you think they are dumb or not. Furthermore, it is not government's role to be a power above the people, but rather it derives its power from the consent of the people. That's what was written in the Declaration of Independence, and (even though you're probably going to call me stupid for saying so) I believe it still holds true today.

 

[Mockingbird]

I can't believe I'm hearing this. You're basically advocating a totalitarian society.

A small group of elite people makes all the decisions for the majority; that's what you're saying right? And what happens when the "dumb majority" doesn't accept your rule? You'll force them to accept it, because as the intelligent elite, you know better than they do what's best for them.

This has played out in history before, and it always ends the same way. The founding fathers of this counrty dveloped our system of government specifically to avoid this.

"We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. - That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed"

What you are saying goes against the very fabric of this nation. I realize you don't believe in God, but this country is founded on the principle that everyone is a unique, fearful, and wonderful creation, and they are to have equal rights, whether you think they are dumb or not. Furthermore, it is not government's role to be a power above the people, but rather it derives its power from the consent of the people. That's what was written in the Declaration of Independence, and (even though you're probably going to call me stupid for saying so) I believe it still holds true today.

 

[Mockingbird]

I can't believe I'm hearing this. You're basically advocating a totalitarian society.

A small group of elite people makes all the decisions for the majority; that's what you're saying right? And what happens when the "dumb majority" doesn't accept your rule? You'll force them to accept it, because as the intelligent elite, you know better than they do what's best for them.

This has played out in history before, and it always ends the same way. The founding fathers of this counrty dveloped our system of government specifically to avoid this.

"We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. - That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed"

What you are saying goes against the very fabric of this nation. I realize you don't believe in God, but this country is founded on the principle that everyone is a unique, fearful, and wonderful creation, and they are to have equal rights, whether you think they are dumb or not. Furthermore, it is not government's role to be a power above the people, but rather it derives its power from the consent of the people. That's what was written in the Declaration of Independence, and (even though you're probably going to call me stupid for saying so) I believe it still holds true today.

 

[Mockingbird]

I can't believe I'm hearing this. You're basically advocating a totalitarian society.
<br />
<br />A small group of elite people makes all the decisions for the majority; that's what you're saying right? And what happens when the "dumb majority" doesn't accept your rule? You'll force them to accept it, because as the intelligent elite, you know better than they do what's best for them.
<br />
<br />This has played out in history before, and it always ends the same way. The founding fathers of this counrty dveloped our system of government specifically to avoid this.
<br />
<br />"We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. - That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed"
<br />
<br />What you are saying goes against the very fabric of this nation. I realize you don't believe in God, but this country is founded on the principle that everyone is a unique, fearful, and wonderful creation, and they are to have equal rights, whether you think they are dumb or not. Furthermore, it is not government's role to be a power above the people, but rather it derives its power from the consent of the people. That's what was written in the Declaration of Independence, and (even though you're probably going to call me stupid for saying so) I believe it still holds true today.

 

[Solo]

Well Mockingbird, I ask you what kind of people do you believe pushes humanity as a whole to progress? Intelligent people have always (Notice I said always) THROUGOUT HISTORY invented things and discovered newer technologies to allow us to progress. You can deny it all you want but you cannot make up your own facts, and facts don't lie. From the wheel, the internal combustion engine, the atom to gunpowder it was always the intelligent that strived to build a better future for all of humanity, but unfortunately, they allowed mental midgets to benefit from their wits, who a lot of times, used totally peaceful inventions for distortedly devious means, ie. Nuclear energy.

Now to the totalitarian thingie, not exactly. If when automobiles were invented, if we would have come out with polls that asked if they were wanted or necessary, the majority, who didn't know anything about cars, "the dumb majority" would vote no, and we would still be riding around in horse drawn carriages.

Now if you're totally fine with mental yahoos deciding life-changing matters for the rest of humanity, that's your choice, but I think in order for us to progress, we need to place people that are more able to find the solutions to problems that plague us, after all, how can you expect the very same minds that created these problems to find solutions to them?

 

[Solo]

Well Mockingbird, I ask you what kind of people do you believe pushes humanity as a whole to progress? Intelligent people have always (Notice I said always) THROUGOUT HISTORY invented things and discovered newer technologies to allow us to progress. You can deny it all you want but you cannot make up your own facts, and facts don't lie. From the wheel, the internal combustion engine, the atom to gunpowder it was always the intelligent that strived to build a better future for all of humanity, but unfortunately, they allowed mental midgets to benefit from their wits, who a lot of times, used totally peaceful inventions for distortedly devious means, ie. Nuclear energy.

Now to the totalitarian thingie, not exactly. If when automobiles were invented, if we would have come out with polls that asked if they were wanted or necessary, the majority, who didn't know anything about cars, "the dumb majority" would vote no, and we would still be riding around in horse drawn carriages.

Now if you're totally fine with mental yahoos deciding life-changing matters for the rest of humanity, that's your choice, but I think in order for us to progress, we need to place people that are more able to find the solutions to problems that plague us, after all, how can you expect the very same minds that created these problems to find solutions to them?

 

[Solo]

Well Mockingbird, I ask you what kind of people do you believe pushes humanity as a whole to progress? Intelligent people have always (Notice I said always) THROUGOUT HISTORY invented things and discovered newer technologies to allow us to progress. You can deny it all you want but you cannot make up your own facts, and facts don't lie. From the wheel, the internal combustion engine, the atom to gunpowder it was always the intelligent that strived to build a better future for all of humanity, but unfortunately, they allowed mental midgets to benefit from their wits, who a lot of times, used totally peaceful inventions for distortedly devious means, ie. Nuclear energy.

Now to the totalitarian thingie, not exactly. If when automobiles were invented, if we would have come out with polls that asked if they were wanted or necessary, the majority, who didn't know anything about cars, "the dumb majority" would vote no, and we would still be riding around in horse drawn carriages.

Now if you're totally fine with mental yahoos deciding life-changing matters for the rest of humanity, that's your choice, but I think in order for us to progress, we need to place people that are more able to find the solutions to problems that plague us, after all, how can you expect the very same minds that created these problems to find solutions to them?

 

[Solo]

Well Mockingbird, I ask you what kind of people do you believe pushes humanity as a whole to progress? Intelligent people have always (Notice I said always) THROUGOUT HISTORY invented things and discovered newer technologies to allow us to progress. You can deny it all you want but you cannot make up your own facts, and facts don't lie. From the wheel, the internal combustion engine, the atom to gunpowder it was always the intelligent that strived to build a better future for all of humanity, but unfortunately, they allowed mental midgets to benefit from their wits, who a lot of times, used totally peaceful inventions for distortedly devious means, ie. Nuclear energy.

Now to the totalitarian thingie, not exactly. If when automobiles were invented, if we would have come out with polls that asked if they were wanted or necessary, the majority, who didn't know anything about cars, "the dumb majority" would vote no, and we would still be riding around in horse drawn carriages.

Now if you're totally fine with mental yahoos deciding life-changing matters for the rest of humanity, that's your choice, but I think in order for us to progress, we need to place people that are more able to find the solutions to problems that plague us, after all, how can you expect the very same minds that created these problems to find solutions to them?

 

[Solo]

Well Mockingbird, I ask you what kind of people do you believe pushes humanity as a whole to progress? Intelligent people have always (Notice I said always) THROUGOUT HISTORY invented things and discovered newer technologies to allow us to progress. You can deny it all you want but you cannot make up your own facts, and facts don't lie. From the wheel, the internal combustion engine, the atom to gunpowder it was always the intelligent that strived to build a better future for all of humanity, but unfortunately, they allowed mental midgets to benefit from their wits, who a lot of times, used totally peaceful inventions for distortedly devious means, ie. Nuclear energy.
<br />
<br />Now to the totalitarian thingie, not exactly. If when automobiles were invented, if we would have come out with polls that asked if they were wanted or necessary, the majority, who didn't know anything about cars, "the dumb majority" would vote no, and we would still be riding around in horse drawn carriages.
<br />
<br />Now if you're totally fine with mental yahoos deciding life-changing matters for the rest of humanity, that's your choice, but I think in order for us to progress, we need to place people that are more able to find the solutions to problems that plague us, after all, how can you expect the very same minds that created these problems to find solutions to them?
<br />

 

[just1more]

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>The founding fathers of this counrty dveloped our system of government specifically to avoid this. </end quote></div>

I have to clarify that the founder fathers very clearly in their writings questioned the ability of us to rule ourselves. This was (based upon other writings) the primary purpose of the electoral college.

The people pick a group of individuals who then decide the President. They are tasked with doing the best for the country, not necessarily listining to the 'masses'.

Through the centuries some of the most evil leaders in history have been supported by a majority. It only proves that sometimes just because everyone agrees it is not necessarily correct.

I have no doubt this offends the core sensibility of many, but ultimately even our founding fathers knew that the average person could be led to make dumb decisions and needed help leading themselves.

 

[just1more]

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>The founding fathers of this counrty dveloped our system of government specifically to avoid this. </end quote></div>

I have to clarify that the founder fathers very clearly in their writings questioned the ability of us to rule ourselves. This was (based upon other writings) the primary purpose of the electoral college.

The people pick a group of individuals who then decide the President. They are tasked with doing the best for the country, not necessarily listining to the 'masses'.

Through the centuries some of the most evil leaders in history have been supported by a majority. It only proves that sometimes just because everyone agrees it is not necessarily correct.

I have no doubt this offends the core sensibility of many, but ultimately even our founding fathers knew that the average person could be led to make dumb decisions and needed help leading themselves.

 

[just1more]

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>The founding fathers of this counrty dveloped our system of government specifically to avoid this. </end quote></div>

I have to clarify that the founder fathers very clearly in their writings questioned the ability of us to rule ourselves. This was (based upon other writings) the primary purpose of the electoral college.

The people pick a group of individuals who then decide the President. They are tasked with doing the best for the country, not necessarily listining to the 'masses'.

Through the centuries some of the most evil leaders in history have been supported by a majority. It only proves that sometimes just because everyone agrees it is not necessarily correct.

I have no doubt this offends the core sensibility of many, but ultimately even our founding fathers knew that the average person could be led to make dumb decisions and needed help leading themselves.

 

[just1more]

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>The founding fathers of this counrty dveloped our system of government specifically to avoid this. </end quote>

I have to clarify that the founder fathers very clearly in their writings questioned the ability of us to rule ourselves. This was (based upon other writings) the primary purpose of the electoral college.

The people pick a group of individuals who then decide the President. They are tasked with doing the best for the country, not necessarily listining to the 'masses'.

Through the centuries some of the most evil leaders in history have been supported by a majority. It only proves that sometimes just because everyone agrees it is not necessarily correct.

I have no doubt this offends the core sensibility of many, but ultimately even our founding fathers knew that the average person could be led to make dumb decisions and needed help leading themselves.

 

[just1more]

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>The founding fathers of this counrty dveloped our system of government specifically to avoid this. </end quote>
<br />
<br />I have to clarify that the founder fathers very clearly in their writings questioned the ability of us to rule ourselves. This was (based upon other writings) the primary purpose of the electoral college.
<br />
<br />The people pick a group of individuals who then decide the President. They are tasked with doing the best for the country, not necessarily listining to the 'masses'.
<br />
<br />Through the centuries some of the most evil leaders in history have been supported by a majority. It only proves that sometimes just because everyone agrees it is not necessarily correct.
<br />
<br />I have no doubt this offends the core sensibility of many, but ultimately even our founding fathers knew that the average person could be led to make dumb decisions and needed help leading themselves.

 

[Mockingbird]

Internal combustion engine: Nikolaus August Otto; dropped out of high school at the age of sixteen

Earliest mention of gunpowder from 9th century China: "Some have heated together sulfur, realgar, and saltpeter with honey; smoke and flames result, so that their hands and faces have been burnt, and even the whole house where they were working burned down." (By the way, the general consensus is that they were alchemists, searching for an elixir of immortality.

The Atomic Bomb: Developed by the Manhattan Project, which was authorized by Franklin Delano Roosevelt as a direct result of a letter signed by Albert Einstein and Leo Szilard urging US development of the Atomic Bomb. The director of the Manhattan Project, J Robert Oppenheimer. He eventually took Einstein's old position of Senior Professor of Theoretical Physics at the Institute for Advanced Study.

Also, the Automobile was first mass produced under a free market system, so according to an earlier statement by you people did vote on it with their money.

I don't think humanity progresses as the result of any one group of people. Henry Ford may have been intelligent, but he needed the "dumb" working class for his assembly lines to work. And being intelligent doesn't mean you are incorruptible, nor does it mean you are incapable of mistakes, and especially doesn't mean you have an inherent inclination toward good.

As far as the founding fathers, I don't see how the electoral college contradicts what I said. <div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>The <b>people</b> pick a group of individuals who then decide the President</end quote></div> Also, please show me where it was written the founding fathers thought we were too dumb to make decisions. According to a source I found: <div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>A third idea was to have the president elected by a direct popular vote. Direct election was rejected not because the Framers of the Constitution doubted public intelligence but rather because they feared that without sufficient information about candidates from outside their State, people would naturally vote for a "favorite son" from their own State or region.</end quote></div><a target=_blank class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://uselectionatlas.org/INFORMATION/INFORMATION/electcollege_history.php">http://uselectionatlas.org/INF...ectcollege_history.php</a>

 

[Mockingbird]

Internal combustion engine: Nikolaus August Otto; dropped out of high school at the age of sixteen

Earliest mention of gunpowder from 9th century China: "Some have heated together sulfur, realgar, and saltpeter with honey; smoke and flames result, so that their hands and faces have been burnt, and even the whole house where they were working burned down." (By the way, the general consensus is that they were alchemists, searching for an elixir of immortality.

The Atomic Bomb: Developed by the Manhattan Project, which was authorized by Franklin Delano Roosevelt as a direct result of a letter signed by Albert Einstein and Leo Szilard urging US development of the Atomic Bomb. The director of the Manhattan Project, J Robert Oppenheimer. He eventually took Einstein's old position of Senior Professor of Theoretical Physics at the Institute for Advanced Study.

Also, the Automobile was first mass produced under a free market system, so according to an earlier statement by you people did vote on it with their money.

I don't think humanity progresses as the result of any one group of people. Henry Ford may have been intelligent, but he needed the "dumb" working class for his assembly lines to work. And being intelligent doesn't mean you are incorruptible, nor does it mean you are incapable of mistakes, and especially doesn't mean you have an inherent inclination toward good.

As far as the founding fathers, I don't see how the electoral college contradicts what I said. <div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>The <b>people</b> pick a group of individuals who then decide the President</end quote></div> Also, please show me where it was written the founding fathers thought we were too dumb to make decisions. According to a source I found: <div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>A third idea was to have the president elected by a direct popular vote. Direct election was rejected not because the Framers of the Constitution doubted public intelligence but rather because they feared that without sufficient information about candidates from outside their State, people would naturally vote for a "favorite son" from their own State or region.</end quote></div><a target=_blank class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://uselectionatlas.org/INFORMATION/INFORMATION/electcollege_history.php">http://uselectionatlas.org/INF...ectcollege_history.php</a>

 

[Mockingbird]

Internal combustion engine: Nikolaus August Otto; dropped out of high school at the age of sixteen

Earliest mention of gunpowder from 9th century China: "Some have heated together sulfur, realgar, and saltpeter with honey; smoke and flames result, so that their hands and faces have been burnt, and even the whole house where they were working burned down." (By the way, the general consensus is that they were alchemists, searching for an elixir of immortality.

The Atomic Bomb: Developed by the Manhattan Project, which was authorized by Franklin Delano Roosevelt as a direct result of a letter signed by Albert Einstein and Leo Szilard urging US development of the Atomic Bomb. The director of the Manhattan Project, J Robert Oppenheimer. He eventually took Einstein's old position of Senior Professor of Theoretical Physics at the Institute for Advanced Study.

Also, the Automobile was first mass produced under a free market system, so according to an earlier statement by you people did vote on it with their money.

I don't think humanity progresses as the result of any one group of people. Henry Ford may have been intelligent, but he needed the "dumb" working class for his assembly lines to work. And being intelligent doesn't mean you are incorruptible, nor does it mean you are incapable of mistakes, and especially doesn't mean you have an inherent inclination toward good.

As far as the founding fathers, I don't see how the electoral college contradicts what I said. <div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>The <b>people</b> pick a group of individuals who then decide the President</end quote></div> Also, please show me where it was written the founding fathers thought we were too dumb to make decisions. According to a source I found: <div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>A third idea was to have the president elected by a direct popular vote. Direct election was rejected not because the Framers of the Constitution doubted public intelligence but rather because they feared that without sufficient information about candidates from outside their State, people would naturally vote for a "favorite son" from their own State or region.</end quote></div><a target=_blank class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://uselectionatlas.org/INFORMATION/INFORMATION/electcollege_history.php">http://uselectionatlas.org/INF...ectcollege_history.php</a>

 

[Mockingbird]

Internal combustion engine: Nikolaus August Otto; dropped out of high school at the age of sixteen

Earliest mention of gunpowder from 9th century China: "Some have heated together sulfur, realgar, and saltpeter with honey; smoke and flames result, so that their hands and faces have been burnt, and even the whole house where they were working burned down." (By the way, the general consensus is that they were alchemists, searching for an elixir of immortality.

The Atomic Bomb: Developed by the Manhattan Project, which was authorized by Franklin Delano Roosevelt as a direct result of a letter signed by Albert Einstein and Leo Szilard urging US development of the Atomic Bomb. The director of the Manhattan Project, J Robert Oppenheimer. He eventually took Einstein's old position of Senior Professor of Theoretical Physics at the Institute for Advanced Study.

Also, the Automobile was first mass produced under a free market system, so according to an earlier statement by you people did vote on it with their money.

I don't think humanity progresses as the result of any one group of people. Henry Ford may have been intelligent, but he needed the "dumb" working class for his assembly lines to work. And being intelligent doesn't mean you are incorruptible, nor does it mean you are incapable of mistakes, and especially doesn't mean you have an inherent inclination toward good.

As far as the founding fathers, I don't see how the electoral college contradicts what I said. <div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>The <b>people</b> pick a group of individuals who then decide the President</end quote> Also, please show me where it was written the founding fathers thought we were too dumb to make decisions. According to a source I found: <div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>A third idea was to have the president elected by a direct popular vote. Direct election was rejected not because the Framers of the Constitution doubted public intelligence but rather because they feared that without sufficient information about candidates from outside their State, people would naturally vote for a "favorite son" from their own State or region.</end quote><a target=_blank class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://uselectionatlas.org/INFORMATION/INFORMATION/electcollege_history.php">http://uselectionatlas.org/INF...ectcollege_history.php</a>

 

[Mockingbird]

Internal combustion engine: Nikolaus August Otto; dropped out of high school at the age of sixteen
<br />
<br />Earliest mention of gunpowder from 9th century China: "Some have heated together sulfur, realgar, and saltpeter with honey; smoke and flames result, so that their hands and faces have been burnt, and even the whole house where they were working burned down." (By the way, the general consensus is that they were alchemists, searching for an elixir of immortality.
<br />
<br />The Atomic Bomb: Developed by the Manhattan Project, which was authorized by Franklin Delano Roosevelt as a direct result of a letter signed by Albert Einstein and Leo Szilard urging US development of the Atomic Bomb. The director of the Manhattan Project, J Robert Oppenheimer. He eventually took Einstein's old position of Senior Professor of Theoretical Physics at the Institute for Advanced Study.
<br />
<br />Also, the Automobile was first mass produced under a free market system, so according to an earlier statement by you people did vote on it with their money.
<br />
<br />I don't think humanity progresses as the result of any one group of people. Henry Ford may have been intelligent, but he needed the "dumb" working class for his assembly lines to work. And being intelligent doesn't mean you are incorruptible, nor does it mean you are incapable of mistakes, and especially doesn't mean you have an inherent inclination toward good.
<br />
<br />As far as the founding fathers, I don't see how the electoral college contradicts what I said. <div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>The <b>people</b> pick a group of individuals who then decide the President</end quote> Also, please show me where it was written the founding fathers thought we were too dumb to make decisions. According to a source I found: <div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>A third idea was to have the president elected by a direct popular vote. Direct election was rejected not because the Framers of the Constitution doubted public intelligence but rather because they feared that without sufficient information about candidates from outside their State, people would naturally vote for a "favorite son" from their own State or region.</end quote><a target=_blank class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://uselectionatlas.org/INFORMATION/INFORMATION/electcollege_history.php">http://uselectionatlas.org/INF...ectcollege_history.php</a>